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HomeMy WebLinkAbout09 - Hearing TranscriptGroup Residential Use Permit Hearing Transcript (1115 West Balboa) Av.aoc OR 0257 Li Lill A 0 A E P] 21 Alp CERTIFIED COPY PUBLIC HEARING ON OCEAN RECOVERY, LLC BEFORE THOMAS W. ALLEN, ESQ., HEARING OFFICER NEWPORT BEACH, CALIFORNIA THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 12, 2009 PRIEC ISE REPORTING SERVICE (714) 647-9099 • (800) 647-9099 • FAX (714) 543-1614 www.precisereporting.com .e7 ej.1-lyw;l 7 a u 0 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 Public hearing was taken on behalf of the City of Newport Beach at 3300 Newport Boulevard, Newport Beach, California, beginning at 4:00 p.m., and ending at 6:25 p.m., on Thursday, February 12, 2009, 'before LAURA A. MILLSAP, RPR, Certified Shorthand Reporter No. 9266. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 21 OR 0259 .23 M C 3 C C 7 0 0 J E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 ( APPEARANCES: For The City of Newport Beach: RICHARDS, WATSON, GERSHON BY: PATRICK K. BOBKO, ESQ. 355 S. Grand Avenue, 40th Floor Los Angeles, CA 90071 -3101 (213) 626 -8484 CITY OF NEWPORT BEACH BY: DAVE KIFF, Assistant City Manager DEBBIE LINN, Associate Planner JANET BROWN, Associate Planner NOELANI MIDDENWAY, Assistant City Clerk 3300 Newport Boulevard Newport Beach, CA 92658 -8915 (949) 644 -3002 For Ocean Recovery, LLC: SHEPPARD, MULLIN, RICHTER & HAMPTON, LLP BY: SEAN P. O'CONNOR, ESQ. 650 Town Center Drive, 4th Floor Costa Mesa, CA 92626 -1993 (714) 513 -5100 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 3 OR 0260 U C U 0 1-1 U J7 A 11 LJ E) 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 NEWPORT BEACH, CALIFORNIA; THURSDAY,. FEBRUARY 12, 2009 4:00 P.M. - 6:25 P.M. MR. ALLEN: All right. We'll open up the hearings for today, Thursday, February 12th. I'm Thomas W. Allen, the Hearing Examiner appointed by the City to conduct these hearings. We have two items on the agenda today. First item is 1601 West Balboa Boulevard, Ocean Recovery. Does everyone per chance have their cell phones turned off? We'll go on a normal course here, where the staff will do a report, there may be questions, and then we'll open up the public hearing and give the public an opportunity to present their views. So with respect to 1601, do we have a staff report, please? MS. LINN: Yes. This item is a request for approval of the use permit for the continued operation of a residential care facility at 1601 West Balboa Boulevard, use permit number 2008 -031. The application is for the continued use of a four -unit residential building at the subject address with a total of 10 bedrooms and 16 beds. The facility is licensed for 16 beds, and they currently occupy the total 16 beds, meaning they are ADP licensed. They have on PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 41 OR 0261 s 0 b FI 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 site -- the facility has four off - street parking garages, and the operations of the facility are summarized in your staff report. Staff is recommending approval of this use permit subject to a number of conditions being included that would assure that their operations are in a manner that are compatible with the surrounding neighborhood. One significant condition of which includes the reduction of their bed count from 16 to 14 in order to accommodate -- better accommodate parking on the facility and also to address some of the concerns that may have arisen due to the public comments that are also summarized in your staff report. We have received additional public comments that were e- mailed to the City on the 11th, yesterday, and they are also, I believe, on the desk for you and included in a package at the counter. Based on the conditions of approval, staff is recommending approval of the subject application. The Hearing Officer -- we believe all the findings can be met if the conditions of approval are included. As an alternative, the Hearing Officer may also determine that the application should be continued or denied. And staff is requesting that the Hearing Officer direct staff to return with a Resolution of Approval for PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 MI OR 0262 C 0 0 0 a ZI E 0< 0 0 Fil 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 the project, subject to the conditions listed in your staff report. And that concludes our presentation, if you have any questions on this matter. MR. ALLEN: I don't have any questions at the moment. Is the Applicant here and wish to make a presentation? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Sure. My name is Jim McCloskey with Ocean Recovery. And I guess I'd like to start off by saying that, first of all, both of our facilities are licensed facilities, and I know we're only talking with 1601 here, but the person that's in charge or manager has a Master level education and has been in the counseling for -- in.this field for about 25 years. We, again, as I mentioned, are a licensed facility. We started very, very small. We started with two clients. we've grown up into where we are today. So our theory was, we grew very, very small with no mistakes, and that's how we're able to grow to the size that we are today. You know, to my knowledge at 1601, we haven't had any complaints by the surrounding neighborhood. I don't know if that's accurate or not, but to my knowledge, there hasn't been any -- there was some concerns about the parking, which we've already addressed PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a OR 0263 C a E E 0 r El E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 the parking, and we've taken care of it. we've converted it back to a parking garage. That's about all I can really say about 1601, unless there's anything else you'd like for me to go into. MR. ALLEN: How many spaces had to be converted back? MR. MC CLOSKEY: I believe three? Or was it four? MS. LINN: Four. MR. ALLEN: Four? ICI MR. MC CLOSKEY: I'm sorry. There's only three there, I believe. And there's four at the other. MR. KIFF: Our staff report indicates that Ithere's four, so -- MR. MC CLOSKEY: There is four. MR. KIFF: Okay. MR. ALLEN: Do you believe you're able to operate successfully given the constraints of the conditions that are proposed by the staff? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Yeah, I think we can operate at 14, and I think we can manage it correctly, yes. MR. ALLEN: All right. Let's open the public hearing, then, and see if -- the Applicant -- excuse me. Go ahead. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 71 OR 0264 M C 7 3 0 C 0 0 0 3 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 MR. O'CONNOR: I apologize for interrupting. I'm Sean O'Conner. I'm an attorney at the Law Firm of Sheppard, Mullin, Richter & Hampton. And I represent Ocean Recovery. And I'm going to let Mr. McCloskey do most of the speaking, and I'll save most of my comments for the application on 1115. I did want to address just a couple of conditions that are part of the application for 1601. As Mr. McCloskey stated, we probably could operate with a suggested condition of a reduction in bed count to 14. we do believe that a bed count of 16 would be more appropriate. That's what it's currently licensed for by the ADP. Indeed, we have 10 bedrooms at this facility. So there is room for more than the currently licensed 16 already. So we think that 16 would be a reasonable number. We also have concerns, Mr. Allen, regarding proposed condition number seven. That is to do with the smoking. And to my knowledge, there have been no complaints about secondhand smoke as to this particular facility. There's a different issue with the 1115. We'll get to that in a bit. But there have been no complaints regarding smoking -- secondhand smoke as to 1601. Yet, the condition for 1601 is just as onerous as is the case for 1115. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 OR 0265 0 0 0 u 0 0 F7 0 0 E El 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 And what that condition requires in part is that smoking outdoors is prohibited. I've done a little research on this, and I'm aware of no other property in the entire City that has been subjected to such an onerous condition that says to the property owner, "You cannot even smoke on your own property." We'd be willing to work with the City to find a solution that would control secondhand smoke to the extent that it is an issue here. Again, there has been no evidence to suggest that is an issue at this particular property. So that condition as worded is problematic to us. Lastly -- and this is something I think could be revised rather easily -- condition number 26, which has to do with the requiring of a new amendment or, excuse me, a new use permit or an amendment to the use permit if there is, among other things, a change on on -site staffing. Carried to its logical extreme, what that could mean is that if we merely lose one employee and hire another employee, we would have to come back down here to the City for either an amendment to the use permit or an entirely new use permit. I don't think that's the intent of this condition, but that's the way that it's read legally. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 ill OR 0266 0 n C J D 0 0 E E E J 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 MR. ALLEN: Thank you. MR. O'CONNOR: We'd be happy to respond to any questions either now or after public comment. MR. ALLEN: Thank you. Maybe we should give staff -- MR. KIFF: Maybe, Sean or Jim, if you could stay up by the podium and address -- I think on condition 26, you're right. It's not our intent to say that if Mary replaces Joe, that that's an approval. I think it's a change in on -site staffing that would either reduce the management capability -- the on -site management capability and supervision that would cause a concern to us in the neighborhood, that we would want that to come back. So it wouldn't necessarily mean a change in the persons or even positions, but just so we knew that same expertise was on staff and stayed on staff. That's fine. That wouldn't need to come back, if that's clear. Or a change, say, in addition of several staff members that would impact the parking in the area so significantly that it's not the same use that we envision today. So if that context is acceptable to you, that's acceptable to us. On smoking, I don't know if maybe -- I realize this is a little bit small scale, but I think the biggest PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (8 00) 64 7- 909 9 UI OR 0267 D 0 L D 0 0 0 El E J 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 concern the City would have is if -- I'm sure my batteries always die when I need this -- if smoking occurs such that it impacts the neighbor on the left or the neighbor behind that -- now the winds do generally go in across the street, but I'd be interested to know what the outside smoking area is now for 1601. Is it -- or when folks need to smoke, where do they go? MR. MC CLOSKEY: It is a designated area that's actually out on the patio incorporated up against the wall. So if it's an L shape, they are actually back against the bottom of the L of the L shape. MR. KIFF: Okay. So they are closer to Ocean Front alley and 16th? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Correct. MR. KIFF: So I guess our thinking would be if there's a way that that stays in the smoking area -- and you're right, we haven't had specific complaints. It's not to say we wouldn't from this facility -- but that there be an opportunity to install maybe some plexiglas or some type of area that at least funnels the smoke up instead of straight across into the neighbor's window. Our intent was not to literally prohibit it if it's not prohibited to any typical residence. But that there be some accommodation made to try and keep the smoke from getting into the neighbor's windows. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 11 OR 0268 0 0 0 i 0 a El G C 3 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 MR. MC CLOSKEY: I guess that is something that we can examine. The only issue -- I think especially in that location we haven't had a problem with that. And really, if it funnels anywhere, it funnels into the alley or 16th Street area. So I don't know where we would redirect it to. MR. KIFF: Well, maybe when we come back, if this is the course that we take, we would wordsmith that condition. Because I think the "prohibition" word is, indeed, too strong. It should be limited so that it's literally in the terms of the Ordinance, so that the neighboring properties aren't affected by it. So that's our goal. And if that's our goal, there are probably a variety of paths to get there. MR. O'CONNOR: Mr. Allen, with those clarifications -- thank you, Mr. Kiff, by the way -- we are fine with the condition number 26 with that clarification. And similarly, condition number 7, it seems like we will be able to work something out concerning the concern on smoke. MR. ALLEN: All right. Thank you. So you're satisfied with being able to leave the conditions the way they are, given staff's interpretations that you'll -- MR. MC CLOSKEY: Work together to -- PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 12 OR 0269 E C C L 0 0 0 U 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 MR. ALLEN: -- work with them, recognizing this condition will be there, and you could ultimately be required to comply with it precisely? MR. KIFF: Well, with the clarification, Mr. Allen, I do think there needs to be a wordsmithing on Iboth 7 and 26 to make it the way I interpreted it three minutes ago. So we will -- I think the wording will change when you see it next, if that's, indeed, the path this takes. MR. O'CONNOR: And Mr. Allen, to directly address your question, the short answer is yes. We would be agreeable to this. That's not to say that these conditions are not onerous, and it's not to say -- MR. ALLEN: Right. MR. O'CONNOR: -- we don't have problems with them, and I'll probably address this more as it relates to 1115. Indeed, we do question the legality of the Ordinance in the entire process we're going through. But our attitude today is the same as it's been the last 12 months. We are working to find a cooperative solution to a difficult problem that's been presented here. And we would like to do so today. So with that mindset, we would be agreeable to those conditions as clarified by Mr. Kiff. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 13 OR 0270 0 0 0 U 0 J L 0 11 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 MR. ALLEN: Does anyone have the Ordinance language right up there? I'm trying to bring it up here, and it will take me a moment, I know. But does it essentially say that smoke shall be controlled in such a fashion that it does not disbursed or is not detectable on neighboring properties? Is that what the Ordinance says? MR. KIFF: That's what it generally says, and I will put it up with you here. We're not getting Internet connection. You might, Mr. Allen, if you wanted to start the public comment, we can come back and revisit this as I try to get back on the Internet. If worse comes to worse, I'll run to my office. MR. ALLEN: I have it here, but I'll have to find -- MR. KIFF: Okay. I can find it if you're logged on. MS. BROWN: It's Item A, 2091050, Item A. MR. ALLEN: 050? MS. BROWN: Yes. MR. ALLEN: Okay. "No staff, et cetera, may smoke in an area from which the secondhand smoke may be detected on any parcel other than the parcel on which the facility is located." PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 14 OR 0271 C 7 7 C M n C7 0 r 7 EA 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 So that's even more rigid. If it's detected on adjacent property, it's a violation. That certainly does take care it of it from an enforcement point of view if complaints are received. MR. KIFF: That's why I think the goal of the Ordinance, Mr. Allen, was to encourage or discourage the concept of 12 or 14 or 10 people all gathering in the same area and smoking at the same time; That if somebody wants to smoke, they -- maybe they take a walk. Maybe it's one person. Obviously the preference is that folks get on maybe a smoking cessation program. I realize that can be unreasonable in many cases. But I think you'll hear from -- consistently, and we heard consistently last year as this Ordinance was being developed, that this is a key problem is a whole group of people all sitting around smoking, and it just overwhelms the neighborhood. And I think more so than a typical single - family use. Even a family with one or two smokers is different than a household with 10 or 12. MR. O'CONNOR: A suggestion only, Mr. Allen. There are some provisions in place as it relates to the Sober Living agreement that address secondhand smoke that looked to be reasonable and looked to address the concerns of secondhand smoke. I have the language here, PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 15 OR 0272 7 0 U A L J 0 0 0 11 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 if you're interested in it. But it's also in the actual zoning agreement as well. MR. ALLEN: Okay. That's a thought then, as far as wordsmithing that Mr. Kiff was suggesting. All right. Let's open the public, or does staff have anything else first? MR. KIFF: No, sir. MR. ALLEN: Let's open the public hearing, then, and please come forward and give us your wisdom. MR. LOPEZ: Mr. Allen and Mr. Kiff, Paul Lopez, 1125 1/2 West Balboa Boulevard, next door neighbor of 1115 but commenting on 1601. I'm going to give Dave here a final package of accumulating information gathered by local residents. And I stress that people on the Peninsula have 144 signatures here opposing both 1601 and 1115. I've got two additional opposition letters that were generated that will refer back to 1115, and miscellaneous communications with Dave Kiff, as well as pictures, of which I was and have been for the last three weeks been trying to coordinate with Mr. Kiff and never got confirmation that I could use these pictures here at the meeting. MR. KIFF: You received it twice, Mr. Lopez, last night and about three weeks ago. You're welcome to PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 16 OR 0273 ED n C U 0 C C E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 use them at the meeting. MR. LOPEZ: Okay. I did not get that communication. So as it relates to 1601, I would like to comment. In talking with several residents, or whatever, the confusion that's been created a little bit by the moving of dates here. So I do look -- as I look out in the audience here, we have some good representation, but do know for a fact that some folks have not been able to attend the meeting today. The 144 signatures and over 13 letters that have been written by local residents apply to both 1601 and 1115. The key components of that opposition are 1601's location to Newport Elementary, which is less than 1,000 feet. Neighbors have experienced repeated nuisance problems over the last five years, including secondhand smoke, profanity, littering and loud noise. This operation provides undue burden on parking and traffic, as evidenced by the operator himself in converting the garages back. This business operation includes neighbors and families that would be frequenting the beaches being a little bit intimidated. And then overconcentration of facilities, which has really been kind of the key argument that we've been discussing here over the last few weeks. The City's PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 17 OR 0274 Z) 0 Fil C 0 n 0 E 9 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009. already approved 1132 West Balboa. There are three other facilities that are operating or seeking approval, which the community has gone on record that feels that all of these are too close to Newport E1 and the playgrounds. My understanding of the City Ordinance 2008 -05 states that the City will protect the integrity of the City's residential areas. And it says that it will include such impact as changes in residential character, noise, secondhand smoke, profanity, and lewd speech, traffic congestion, excessive trash, excessive debris on surrounding sidewalks. I believe that the past behavior demonstrates that this does not meet the spirit of this Ordinance. Thank you. MR. ALLEN: Thank you, Mr. Lopez. Someone else? MR. MATHENA: I'm Larry Mathena. I am actually not sure what to say at this time. Part of the reason I'm not sure is because I've actually reached a certain point of cynicism, especially after seeing, for instance, in the case of the Kramer Center where you're on the cusp of actually issuing an appropriate finding and simply quit, which, in fact, was my real problem with that opportunity. And I see a similar activity going on now. 18 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 OR 02T5 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 If I were the Applicant, I'd love the Sober Living by the Sea standard. It's got nothing to do with the regulation, and it has no teeth, no explicit measurement, no -- nothing precise. It's utterly inappropriate to go from a standard, regulatorily agreed to, that secondhand smoke shouldn't be detected on any other parcel to the Sober Living by the Sea standard of, oh, we'll try hard, especially in a circumstance where you have a huge amount of evidence, not so much at this facility. But my concern is you guys are generating precedents for the next one. And it's wrong. Follow your law. In fact, my biggest complaint of the City as a whole is it doesn't follow the law. And specifically, it doesn't follow the law, I think benignly, it's to avoid being accused of discrimination. And God knows, I mean, a very nice, professional, well written threatening legal letter saying, oh, we could violate ADA, we could violate fair housing, we could do this, that and the other. And in fact, the very introduction of this is, we don't agree with this to begin with. You folks came in here at every one of these hearings telling us, "we set up these Ordinances. we set up these rules," with the understanding and going to the PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 19 OR 0276 0 0 0 0 U I'll 7 0 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 effort of saying they comply with the law. Follow your law. And if not, then admit that you can't. I think it's pathetically sad that it's instantly, oh, that sounds reasonable. That's not the circumstance. You have no right to default of the Sober Living by the Sea standard. One of the reasons you're in this situation is because everybody defaulted instead of thinking through where they should be to begin with. I could go on. And I guess my punch line comment is, you've got to talk loud across the street, you've got a liquor store a block away, and you've got a large day care facility a block and a half away. There's a total illogic to this effort that if your goal was -- your time is fair -- if your goal was trying to do what's right for the community, which was Paul's point, you would come to the conclusion that even this one, which isn't nearly as bad as 1115, shouldn't be approved. Thank you. MR. RUSH: How many minutes? MR. ALLEN: Three. MR. RUSH: Three? Bob Rush, Newport Beach resident. I'm not here to say anything for or against the recovery operator. I just want to mention that I spoken PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 20 OR 0277 C 0 0 0 F1 M a ,1 E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 to Mr. McCloskey a number of times. I find him to be a generous and sincere individual in his efforts to try to work with the community. And that's what I'd like to leave that comment at. But I did want to come up right now, because I need some clarification with this report done by staff planning. I have some problems with it. And I think that it's pertinent to your decision, since you are relying on the information they are giving you, and you are relying on the fact that it's supposedly accurate. Well, I'll give you a couple of examples of where I think it's too loose, not accurate, or perhaps even goes so far to say as intentionally misleading. Page -- of the 115 -- 1115 West Balboa, page 11, if you look -- MR. ALLEN: We're trying to stick with 1601 right now. MR. RUSH: I'm sorry. Okay. It's the same question on both. MR. ALLEN: Okay. MR. RUSH: Okay. The author talks about recovery homes not being proven to be a burden, financial burden, to the City. Yet, nowhere in these reports does the author, Ms. Brown, cite where it is normal for a building to be entirely filled with adults to the point PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 21 OR 0278 G D 0 C 0 0 0 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 of two or three per bedroom. There's no basis in Newport Beach that is the norm of having two to three adults per bedroom. There's no place. Yet, that's not addressed. That's not discussed. That's critical to her recommendation to you by saying there's no proof that this is a burden to the City. So that's one major inaccuracy. Secondly, she says -- she makes the statement that the City has determined that an overconcentration would exist -- the City has determined that an overconcentration would exist if more than one residential care facility exists within one block length. Yet, there's nothing in our municipal code that says that. There's no determination in our municipal code that one house per block is -- or more than one house per block is overconcentrated. Not only that, but the only real point or only real place where this "one house per block" comes from is a singular letter that originated from the previous City attorney's desk going to the Assistant State Attorney General's Office asking for a position, in which he cites an APA survey or study suggesting that one house per block might a way to determine overconcentration. But there is such a variation, even within the Peninsula, that one house per block is a poor standard to PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 22 OR 0279 C C C J J n a C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 use. But in our municipal code, which the author of this report.states, there is no determination. And the last point I'd like to make -- so I'd like her to cite where is it's determined in our code overconcentration is blank. Secondly, she makes no differentiation between facility size. She says one facility per block. I mean, you know, we have a case of a rehab up on Clay and Orange that has 45 people. And -- so according to the author's one facility per block guide, that wouldn't be overconcentrated. Yet, 45 people within a corner, across from a tot lot or a day care center to me is classic overconcentration. Narconon is the same, classic overconcentration, 49 people. Yet -- MR. ALLEN: Your three minutes is up. You can do it at the next one. We did get the point. MR. RUSH: Thank you. MR. ALLEN: Would someone else like to come forward? MS. OBERMAN: Good afternoon, Mr. Allen and staff. Denys Oberman. I wanted to comment on smoking, and this comment is pertinent not only to 1601 but also to 1115, and other facilities. First of all, relative to smoke, cigarette PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 23 OR 0280 7 E E 7 0 0 El 10 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 smoke is a legally recognized known carcinogen. And I think every citizen in this community recognizes the right of people that are in recovery to smoke if they so choose. By the same token, by matter of equity, every citizen in this community that chooses not to smoke has the right not to breathe cigarette smoke. And the reason why it is so important to put that out there is because it's a criteria to consider when deciding whether to recommend approval or denial of this facility. Density needs to be heavily weighted, because there's a lot of difference between a structure and a facility, regardless of its size, where 0 to 100 percent of the people in the facility smoke, where the structure is 3 to 6 feet, or maybe as much as 8 feet, away from the adjacent structures, versus the situation where there isn't that type of structural density, and the structures are, you know, 200 feet away from one another, which is characteristic of what many people call standard subdivisions or other areas. And we had asked for that consideration to be written into the Ordinance. We understand it's something that the Hearing Officer can consider at his discretion. Secondly, overconcentration . Overconcentration creates a compounding effect relative to cigarette smoke PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 24 OR 0281 n u n 0 FJ f 0 F7 0 n F] 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 and having to suffer the impacts of it. If there are more people -- and the people don't just stay in their house. So breathing secondhand smoke is not just a consideration when they are sitting interior or exterior to the residents. It's also people regularly walking down alleys behind other neighbors' houses, going by the school, going on to the beaches and smoking, going to the sidewalks and alleyways. So we beg that you consider those things and you look carefully at the true aspect of overconcentration of facilities and also the density of the neighborhood and the surrounding structures. Thank you. MR. ALLEN: Anyone else? All right. We'll close the public -- I see a person with his finger -- of course, you've already been up here, so -- (Boulevard. MR. LOPEZ: Just one second. THE COURT: You have 30 seconds. THE WITNESS: Yeah, that's fine. THE REPORTER: Your name again? MR. LOPEZ: Paul Lopez, 1125 1/2 West Balboa I just wanted to correct one comment that the PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 25 OR 0282 El E E F] A U. 0 7 F] D 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 operator mentioned in regards to where the folks smoke on the deck out there. It is an L shaped building, but the tables and the place where the residents, who are female, smoke is outside the L. It sits up closer to West Balboa Boulevard than it does blocked by three walls. MR. ALLEN: All right. So we'll close the public hearing. Bring it back to staff. Do you have any some comments with respect to some of the public comments that were made? MR. KIFF: Yes, I do, Mr. Allen. Thank you. I wanted to address -- I'm going start with Bob Rush's comments and address a little bit Denys' and talk about smoking in general. Because -- actually, I signed the staff report, too, so some of those statements where I talk about recovery homes not being a cost burden to the City, they are literally not. Remember, a facility like this, at 1601, is four units and 10 bedrooms. And you -- we have to imagine, from a regulatory standpoint, that this use would have four families in there, and potentially two or three cars per family. This is a use that is being regulated such that it will have four parking spaces and not have any opportunity to need that more or use that more. So that is a little different. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 26 OR 0283 0 D M 0 0 E 0 E7 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 1s 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 But the statement that that was trying to respond to about not being a cost burden was a number of letters and a -mails that I received saying, well, it costs more in police, it costs more in fire, it costs more in trash, it does not. we don't have any more police calls from recovery facilities than we do from vacation homes. And a little bit more both than single family homes, but if this was an apartment use, we would expect that same amount of police cars and EMS calls. And remember, everybody in Newport gets their trash collected for free. It's within your property tax. So there isn't that kind of cost burden either. So that's the genesis of that statement, Bob. I think there is an impact to the structure when you are overwhelming the structure with people. And remember, the bed count that we're proposing is 14 beds within 10 bedrooms. So this facility is four units, 10 bedrooms, 14 beds. So I think that is actually a less intense use than you'd see in a single family use. Bob also talked about the APA standard, and I think it's a fair thing to discuss. And the APA standard, American Planning Association standard, was discussed when this Ordinance was developed. And it is pretty much the only document we ever found -- and we're PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 27 OR 0284 El 0 U O a C] .:J D Q 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 still happy to look -- that discussed from a planning perspective, from a professional planning perspective, what an appropriate number of residential care facility was in any one block. And they didn't say one use. They said one or two uses. And thus, I think you heard Mr. Allen struggling with trying to decipher that in light of the Newport Coast Recovery application. Because it does say one or two uses. And also, it doesn't say that -- it doesn't count beds in those uses. It doesn't say that a six -bed facility should be evaluated differently from a 22 -bed facility. So it's left up to the local jurisdiction to consider. And what we did was adopt the APA standard as a guideline, and then say that in cases where blocks are small, the Hearing Officer can stretch the block out to an average block length of Newport beach. And I think Mr. Allen's last discussion of that was roughly 617 feet. So this facility here at 1601 does not have another facility in its block, even if you stretched that block out to 617 feet, which is why we recommended the approval'. We recommended the lowering in bed count because of the parking spaces. And we have a standard in our code that says one parking space for three beds. So, PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 WI OR 0285 F] 0 V E n 0 L S 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 with the Balboa Horizons facility, we set a precedent by saying if you don't have assembly uses, that potentially you could get two more beds. So sure enough, 1601 West Balboa, they agreed to not have assembly uses. So we did that same ratio, which would have brought it to 12 beds and added two to be consistent with Balboa Horizons. Let me touch briefly on smoking then. Ms. Oberman brings up an important point. Many people, including myself personally, are very concerned about secondhand smoke. We have to treat a recovery home, though, just as we would treat a typical single family use. We don't ban smoking on your personal property. We don't ban smoking in an apartment building where a couple of folks will get out on the ledge and smoke. Now, other communities have banned that. The City of Belmont, in fact, has. If Newport Beach decides to take that step, those types of bans would be applicable to every house in the community, including recovery homes. And that could change the way many of the recovery homes operate here. But the key for me is, we need to treat a recovery home like we treat another facility. And if smoking is not banned in an apartment building, we cannot PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 ail OR 0286 I 2 3 4 5 6 7 B 9 ® 10 11 12 g 13 14 15 16 17 18 ® 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 ban it in a recovery home. To do so, arguably, is discriminatory. That said, I think the Ordinance was strong in trying -- in saying the secondhand smoke should not leave the property. we intend to pursue that and to ensure that at 1601 the secondhand smoke doesn't leave the property. Now, again, that doesn't stop somebody from walking off and smoking down the sidewalk, just like the neighbor could do that as well. Mr. Lopez and Mr. Mathena brought up a number of other issues, and I think they were more in tune to their concerns about 1115, so I'm happy to come back and have that discussion with them on the next item. MR. ALLEN: Any other staff comments? It appears that this secondhand smoke issue in the Ordinance itself is addressed very strongly by saying that no person shall smoke in an area where the secondhand smoke may be detected on any parcel other than the parcel on which the facility is located. That's a lot stronger statement than what I heard was described or done in Sober Living. The Ordinance itself would supercede these conditions anyway, in my estimation. So if the residents are able to do the enforcement and /or get the enforcement done, that's stronger than the use permit conditions. That's the way PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 301 OR 0287 n 0 0 0 E 3 77 0 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 I would see it, keep in mind. Okay. One other point, I think the concentration is not an issue here, but I think it bears just very brief discussion. And I think my thoughts tie into what Mr. Kiff was saying and what Ms. Oberman raised. That in the instance where we have an Ordinance on the books that talks about one or two uses per block, recognizing that that's a large variation, I think the intent there is to take into account the number of beds. So that you could have two 10 -bed facilities, conceivably, in the block, but only one 20 -bed, for example. And I think that's the kind of flexibility that's probably intended in that section. Given the fact that it's probably illegal to create absolute distancing requirements and impose them across the board, I'm sure the City thought about that a great deal in the course of attempting to bring this Ordinance forth with Constitutional restrictions. Anyway, I have listened to the testimony. I do believe that the findings can be met -- have been met. And so on that basis, my motion is to approve this use, to request that the staff bring back an Ordinance or, I mean, a Resolution consistent with the findings that have been made in this staff report, and bring back a PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 31 OR 0288 A 7 :J Q 0 7 M, a. 0 L) 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 Resolution with the conditions of operation that have been recommended. So with that, unless there's anything else? Let's see. Do we need to set a time to consider that Resolution? MR. KIFF: We think we can bring that back to you -- actually, let us work with you on that and propose something back. We need to look at calendars and when you're next going to be here, so -- MR. ALLEN: Okay. MR. KIFF: Potentially, it could be the next Friday during the Yellowstone hearings; correct? MS. LINN: We're short staff. MR. KIFF: Okay. We'll talk about that. MR. ALLEN: Fine. All right. Thank you. All right. So next item on the agenda is 1115 West Balboa Boulevard. MR. KIFF: Mr. Allen, would you like me to make the presentation? MR. ALLEN: Sure. Let's proceed with the presentation. You can summarize the situation better than I can. MR. KIFF: So staff clearly saw this as a different circumstance from 1601 for a number of reasons. We received a great -- well, to me, a significant amount PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 32 OR 0289 0 0 0 0 E C 6 0 0 U7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 of correspondence on this. But it's also in a neighborhood that does have other group residential uses in it and nearby, a couple of which, at least one significantly, at 1129 West Balboa, is scheduled for abatement in what is, in effect, gosh, 11 days. So we did hear some -- both some generalized testimony in opposition to this facility and some very specific testimony in opposition to this facility_ And it was the specific concerns that I think weighed most heavily on staff, because -- I'm going to thumb to a screen where I was trying to summarize that. I'm going to start with some of the things that I don't believe the ordinance allows us to consider in a denial or an approval. And i say this with great respect to the people who offered these opinions and who signed petitions to that effect. But first one is declining home values. There's no evidence to suggest that the presence of a recovery facility is any more impactful on private property values than changes in the housing market, certainly, the presence of long -term rental, vacation rentals, or other non - single family uses. And I think the data shows that nationwide. Another concern that -- actually, I'm going to wobble on this one. Ocean Recovery has continued to PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 33 16PAI 11 E, 0 C 0 C 0 0 E U 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 assert that its residents do not attend a meeting of Narcotics Anonymous on Saturday at 9:30. And I emphasize this meeting, because it has been brought to my attention that the folks who attend this meeting tend to be more aggressive in potentially confronting others and certainly in possibly violating our no smoking on the beach law. And I have discussed this with Ocean Recovery, and they have said up and down, "No, we don't send our folks to this meeting, and they don't go to it." However, I note that Mr. Lopez has submitted a counter to that, saying, "Gosh, they sure do go." So maybe we can discuss that in the public comment. I mentioned already I don't think it's a fair consideration within our Ordinance to allege that recovery homes are a cost burden to the City. The other thing that I think people, again, were very sincere in offering was that this facility's proximity to Newport Elementary School. It is about 740 feet away. And many people wrote me and said, "I can't believe that the City allows these within a thousand feet of an elementary school." I want to stress with you that -- the folks in the audience that distancing from public uses, like elementary schools, has specifically been addressed by PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 34 OR 0291 11 E. 0 0 0 R n L7 M 71 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 Courts like the 9th Circuit and have been rejected. And indeed, in State law, it doesn't allow us to specifically distance one home from another and not from -- one recovery home from a use like an elementary school. So many people assume that the law allows us to do this. And I would assert that the law does not allow us to do this, which is why the text of our Ordinance reads slightly differently. It allows the Hearing Officer to consider the proximity of the use to schools, parks and other care facilities, and other uses which could be affected by or would affect the operation of the i subject use. So what we do, in an analysis on staff's part, is to decide if this use at 1115 West Balboa could be affected by its proximity to the school or affects the operation of the school. And we've seen no evidence on the record from Newport Elementary at 740, 750, either way, that affects this use. And then finally, a concern that we're not able to consider is a general comment about recovery homes Citywide out directing specific comments to the operation of West Balboa. I'm going to move back to things that -- let's see if I can find that slide. I think concerns that the Ordinance does allow us to consider -- and that's allegations made that are PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 35 D 7 I] E] L) IA 0 0 U G 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 specific to this property, which, in staff's eyes, might indicate an inability to manage 1115 in a manner that's respectful to the neighborhood's peace and quiet and quiet enjoyment. And specifically, these are threatening, confrontational, or age- inappropriate interactions of clients with neighbors, excessive profanity, especially when youth are nearby, excessive noise, as well as noise late at night. And then potentially poor and inappropriate responses from clients when neighbors attempt to remedy those interactions by themselves. Excessive secondhand smoke is something that we can address. Trash problems, again, is something that we can address. Curfew violations and what some have alleged to be an apparent lack of adequate on -site supervision. So we did receive -- and these are summarized in the staff report -- some very specific concerns about this property that I thought warranted our addressing them. And the proposal from staff was that we direct that this use be reviewed in six months and that the bed count be lowered to 14 beds to see if there was an opportunity to answer a question in staff's mind is that, is the proximity to 1129 West Balboa causing a number of the problems that are attributed by 1115 West Balboa? PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a. OR 0293 L C G C C C C C 0 0 C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 1s 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 And in fairness to 1115 West Balboa and to this process, I don't believe staff can make the evaluation that all of the problems in that block are caused by 1115. So this time period, staff believe, would have allowed us to take look at the operations without 1129 around and make an evaluation at that time. So I think those are the comments that I'd make and maybe welcome your interaction, Mr. Allen, and the public's interaction from here. MR. ALLEN: Is there an absolute commitment for termination of 1129, or is it just subject to abatement? MR. KIFF: Everything I've been told is that they intend to close the abatement date, which is February 22nd. Now, what we have is a process in place where we will, A, ensure that that occurs, at least through inspection, or otherwise. And if it doesn't occur, we have an administrative procedure and a civil procedure to go through that would cause the abatement. MR. ALLEN: One thing with respect to this application. You've already mentioned, Mr. Kiff, there's been a great deal of correspondence that has come in on this. And are we able to make provision for referencing that or otherwise including it in the record? I think the people that have spent the time to do the amount of work that they have done deserve to be PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 37 OR 0294 M L1 0 E a 0 C '9 G 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 sure that it's in the record for whatever that future purpose may mean. MR. KIFF: Yes, we do, Mr. Allen. Anything that's provided up until the close of the public hearing becomes part of the record associated with this use permit, including a -mails and statements and petitions. And I think I believe I have most, if not all of that. If there's anything I missed, I know that folks will remind me of that, including having an opportunity to say so during the public hearing now. MR. ALLEN: There's a great deal of correspondence from Mr. Lopez, and a great deal of correspondence from Mr. Mathena, and then Mr. Lopez brought us a great deal more here this afternoon. As long as it's all in the record so that -- because I'm thinking in terms of any appeal to City Council; that the Council would have to look at the record, and that that would be included. So thank you. I just want to see if there's any question I have before we -- MR. KIFF: I note, too, Mr. Allen, that, for folks in the audience's benefit, these are -- we do have the Court Reporter here, and these transcript are -- become a public document. We do post them on the Web site. So that is part of the public record as well PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 38 OR 0295 El E E E F7 0 J 0 G 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 that Council would see in any appeal. MR. ALLEN: How long has 1115 been in operation? MR. KIFF: Depends on -- I think that's a better question for Mr. McCloskey to ask, because it depends on what you're asking for. In some cases, their date of licensure as this activity dates back -- sorry -- dates back to the time at which they received their ADP license. Others have suggested that this facility, before Ocean Recovery was there, operated similarly but as an unlicensed sober home. So I think that's a better statement made directly by the Applicant. At least your question to staff, we believed it's been in operation since at least 105. MR. ALLEN: All right. Why don't we proceed, then, with the Applicant making the presentation here on this one. MR. O'CONNOR: Thank you, Mr. Allen. Sean O'Connor again, and I represent Ocean Recovery. In addition to representing Ocean Recovery, I'm also a resident of Newport Beach and have been so for 16 years. And one of the things I've grown to a appreciate about this City is the City's attempts to reach fair solutions to difficult problems. And I think PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 WI OR 0296 E 0 D 0 C 0 0 0 0 0 E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 B 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 that certainly applies to the situation we're dealing with tonight. I know that I had a problem five years ago in regard to a City project. My wife and I called the City. Staff came out. Listened to our concerns. In fact, it was Mr. Kiff five years ago. We weren't entirely satisfied. But, looking back at it, I think we now recognize that the solution that was presented to us was a fair one and was a balancing of completing concerns, and we'd hope that we can find a similar situation tonight. We have a difficult situation in our hands, and I think we recognize that no matter what the City decides, no one is going to be entirely happy. From our standpoint, we recognize that group homes are not a popular use. We also recognize, however, that there is federal and state law that afford us various protections. And we also recognize we're providing valuable services to people in need. As I mentioned earlier, it has been our choice not to aggressively fight the City regarding this Ordinance, even though we have problems with the Ordinance. I think the City and the City residents should be thankful for this. They went out and hired a talented team of PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 40 1 OR 0297 0 E 0 0 E E 0 EI U 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 6 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 lawyers to craft this Ordinance. Then, as a lawyer myself, I looked at that Ordinance, and I see it as a good piece of lawyering work that does a lot to protect the concerns of the City residents regarding group homes. Putting on my hat representing a group home, I have concerns about that Ordinance, and I think it pushes the envelope and, indeed, goes too far, But what we're trying to do tonight, just like we've done over the last 12 months, is see if we can work with the process to see if we can come up with a cooperative solution. And I think that staff will tell you that we've adapted that approach from the very beginning. I have provided Mr. Kiff and others on the staff unlimited access to my client, Jim McCloskey, not to be filtered through me. If Mr. Kiff or anyone else has a problem or a question that needs to be answered, they call up Mr. McCloskey, and he gives them a response right away. We've done our best to work with the City. We've done our best to work with the neighbors. I understand that there have been some recent comments and concerns raised by the neighbors, and we'll get to that in just a moment. And Mr. McCloskey would get to that as well. I would note that I submitted a letter, both one that I prepared yesterday and also a letter from Karen Knab, K- n -a -b, of Ocean Recovery that PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 411 OR 0298 M 0 0 0 0 E 0 G A D L 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 attempted to address some of those concerns. we pride ourselves in being a good operator. And I think even though we have some concerns regarding the ordinance in this process, to some extent, we also welcome it, because, as this Ordinance was explained to us by City staff, the intent was to eliminate the bad operators. And we were told directly that we're not viewed as a bad operator. Instead, we are viewed as one of the good operators, if not the best operator, in the City. So to some extent, we welcome that, because we saw that there were some operators out there that probably had no business running these types of operations. We've done other best to be a responsible operator. Having said that, we'd like to become a better operator, if possible. And we're happy to accept some of these proposed conditions to the extent that those will make us an even better operator. What I'd like to do right now, however, is just spend a couple of minutes focusing on some of the proposed conditions which go way too far in our view. In fact, as it relates to one of these conditions, it would put us out of business, and that is the proposed condition reducing the bed count down to 14 beds. As I believe you know, Mr. Allen, we are PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 42 OR 0299 C� Ni is 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 currently licensed through the ADP to have a bed count of 22 beds. The proposed condition reducing that bed count down to 14 is a staggering 36 percent reduction. And in our view, that is not reasonable. And more importantly, I think -- and I think Mr. McCloskey will address this a little more specifically -- that essentially makes a difference between us being able to remain in business and putting us out of business. City staff told us specifically that they don't want to see us go out of business, but, unfortunately and regrettably, if this condition is imposed with 14 beds, it will do just that. It will put us out of business. So we think that this one condition goes way too far. Is there some flexibility within 22? Yes, there is. And we'd be willing to discuss that. But a 36 percent reduction, bringing us from 22 down to 14, is unreasonable. And I don't think that there's been evidence that warrants that. Regarding that evidence -- Mr. McCloskey will speak to that a bit -- the letter submitted by Ms. Knab yesterday addressed that a bit. I will note the following, though, that we have never -- saying it somewhat differently, this a largely news to us. And it caught me by surprise and it caught Mr. McCloskey by surprise to see this level of opposition PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 43 OR 0300 I 0 0 0 7 R E7 C 0 u 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 regarding 1115, particularly when you look at 1601, the facility we just discussed. One letter in opposition, and really not specifically at the operations. we run the same type of operation at 1115 as we do at 1601. So if we were a problem operator, one would expect to see the same types of problems that have been alleged as to 1115 for 1601. There haven't been those types of allegations. I would also note that the timing is a little bit curious. I'm certainly not going to accused anyone in the audience of lying, even though some of those people have accused my client of lying. Instead, there may have been some misunderstandings. It's regrettable that these concerns were not brought to our attention earlier. It's regrettable that these concerns have caught us by surprise. Because had these concerns been brought to our attention in an earlier time, we would have addressed them. We would have addressed them promptly. I think there's some members of the audience who would recognize that Mr. McCloskey has gone to them in the past and said, "If you ever have a problem, here's my cell phone number. Give me a call. I'll get back to you right away." That's the way we do business. So it's a little hard for us, and I would add a PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 ass OR 0301 D 0 D Ell D 2 D .J 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 little unfair for us, to have to comment to -- and address these concerns that have surfaced for the first time after the City noticed this public hearing. I would also note, picking up on something that Mr. Kiff said, as it related to 1601 is that this could be a situation where, where, with all due respect, I think that some of the residents need to be careful for what they asked for. But as it relates to this particular residence, alternative uses could be a lot worse than what is there currently. We currently are licensed for 16, as I mentioned. Fourteen is way too low, but we would be willing to consider something lower than 22. Alternative uses, if this was a rental home, if that was rented out to vacationers, college students, a lot more cars, a lot more trash, no regulations regarding their behavior, no curfew. We have always those things in place right now. So I believe that we can continue to provide valuable services to our clients while, at the same time, being good neighbors. But as it relates to a couple of the conditions -- and we also have concerns regarding the condition on smoking. I would assume that Mr. Kiff's explanation as related to my concern for 1601 regarding the condition as related to smoking would be the same as PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 P 451 OR 0302 J 0 0 7 J 0 0 7 7 ', 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 it applies here. And our concern regarding condition number 27, which was actually condition number 26 for the 1601 property, with those clarifications, we would be accepting of those two conditions. But again, the condition that is an absolute not a start for us is condition number one, which limits us to 14 beds from the currently licensed 22. With that, I'm going to turn it over to Mr. McCloskey, unless you have any questions, Mr. Allen. MR. ALLEN: I was wanting one of you to address this question about -- I believe that there's a condition limiting or prohibiting the assembly uses at this location. And I think that's a very significant issue to be addressed, as well as the ones, of course, that you are objecting to. Because that seems to me to be a significant contributor to the kinds of objections the neighborhood has, the assemblies of groups of people and their resulting behavior that's objectionable by the neighbors. MR. O'CONNOR: That's probably a good segue for Mr. McCloskey to take the stand. Thank you. MR. MC CLOSKEY: Again, Jim McCloskey. I'd like to address that. That's already been PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a, OR 0303 L 0 11 A 0 L C E E Z 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 addressed. The assemblies are now disbanned. They are no longer allowed at the facility. I want to also address the parking. The parking also there has been addressed. The garages has been converted back to garages. I also wanted to emphasize that there's concerns about our group, as mentioned earlier, that they go to NA meetings on a specific date. They do not attend those meetings. So -- and there was another question you had about how long we had been in operation. It's roughly been -- it's hard to say exactly. we've been there for about five years. It roughly took us about a year to get licensed. So we've probably been in operation for just about four years. MR. ALLEN: Have you had dealings with the City prior to the commencement of the actions leading up to the adoption of this Ordinance? Have Code Enforcement or other similar police been called to that facility at all or in any intervals, to your knowledge? MR. MC CLASxEY: To my knowledge, no. I can tell you the only big issues we did have is when we initially took over the property, there were several illegal units. There was -- the amount of people residing there was -- I would say, I'm guessing, it was PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 47 i OR 0304 C 2 C 0 0 C C C J 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 is 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 probably greater than the 22 that we are licensed for right now. MR. ALLEN: Was it a recovery facility? MR. MC CLOSKEY: No, it was a rental unit. So we would have four to five people in a one - bedroom, Band -- of which, I believe, are seven; is that correct? Are seven units, I believe. And there were a bunch of illegal units there, which he had to convert back to the conforming use that it is right now. MR. KIFF: Mr. Allen, if you don't mind it, I'll ask a question of Mr. McCloskey. You just stated this a moment ago, but I wanted to make sure I understood it, because Mr. Lopez in his e -mail -- let me try to read it to you. I think you saw this, because I tried to forward it for the record. "The operator states that the residents from 1115 don't attend weekend NA meetings on the beach. This is not true. In fact, the operator himself has provided the City with his residents' schedules, and they show they clearly attend. "Furthermore, as I sit on my deck Saturday and Sunday mornings, I routinely see residents leaving the 1115 facility, beach chairs in hand and yelling back at slow residents to hurry up, PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 5Um OR 0305 E M n 0 C 7 0 E 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 'We're going to be late for the meeting.' I have followed these groups on several occasions and verified that they do attend these meetings the 15th Street." So I wanted to just make sure I understood whether or not you think they have attended in the past and will stop attending. And I need to -- before you answer that, it's not illegal for Narcotics Anonymous to meet on the beach. It is a big group of people, and I think they are ignoring our smoking -- no smoking on the beach law. And I think there is a problem with loitering and intimidation. But that's not something that is something that's on your shoulders. It's more on mine. But I did want to clarify what your thoughts were about your clients at that meeting. MR. MC CLOSKEY: Yeah. I'd like to address that in a couple of ways. One, have our clients ever attended it? They did. But they have not attended it for about three years. It was not a good environment for our clients. We discouraged them from doing -- we stopped them from doing it. I brought actually this book here. There are 1800 meetings with AA in Orange County. Just the Alana Club across the street here, there's 60 per week. You're PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 U OR 0306 17 E 0 0 0 0 0 E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 talking about one meeting. So I'm talking about 60 that meet one week just right across the street here. There's almost any hour of any day you can go to a meeting. Do our clients go the other meetings? 'Yes. Do they go to the Alana Club? Yes, they do. Do they attend the one on the beach there? No, they do not attend the one on the beach, MR. KIFF: Okay. MR. ALLEN: There seems to be some real difference of opinion with respect to your residents having vehicles. I noticed that some of the communications indicated that a lot of your residents have vehicles. How does that work with your organizational plan? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Yeah. Your clients are not allowed vehicles at either facility. Is there ever a case where a client has had one? There was. And I had to report to Mr. Kiff. There was a case where a gentleman got stuck. He was trying to go home_ He had a car that was not allowed when he was part of our facility. He was stuck over for a two -week period where he did have a car in our facility. But that is the only case that I'm aware of that a client has ever had a car at our facility, one in PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 6141 OR 0307 D 0 c1 3 D D 0 D D 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 the five -plus years that we've been in operation there, or four years, I should say. MR. ALLEN: Okay. Do you have -- can you address this smoking issue anymore? It just seems such an important one, on the one hand, to a lot of people. And by the same token, the City's Ordinances, again I say, clearly prohibits smoke from disbursing to abutting properties that can't be detected. How can you do that? MR. MC CLOSKEY: It's a difficult item to address. All I can tell you is that we're more than willing to work with Mr. Kiff and do the best that we can to control that environment and make it work for everybody. What the right answer is at this particular point in time, to be honest, I don't know. But it's something that we can work towards together to try to accomplish that goal. MR. ALLEN: Okay. Thank you. MR. MC CLOSKEY: Thank you. MR. ALLEN: Let's go with the public hearing and get started here and hear the views of the public on 1115. MR. MYERS: Hello. My name is Jeff Myers, spelled M- y- e -r -s. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 51 s 1 1- F] F-1 M 3 0 0 0 0 El D 1] 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 First thing I'd like to give is, Mr. Kiff, a copy of the City records. Back on 5- 23 -06, there was an investigation into 1115, code investigation. "Please remove accumulated trash and debris from the alley." Now I'd like to start. I'd like to discuss my experience with the company Ocean Recovery. They claim to be a good operator. But in reality, the representatives have been far less than honest with myself, my neighbors, City officials, and also the public in general. Ocean Recovery is a for - profit company that cares more about their profit than preserving our residential neighborhoods. The property at 1115 West Balboa has been investigated in the past by the City Code Enforcement for accumulation of trash and debris in the alley. Yet, they continue to burden the neighbors with this trash. The neighbors still complain that, "Their," meaning Ocean Recovery, "trash is so bad and overstacked, that in the summertime, the flies from the trash have become such a nuisance." Even the past City attorneys states, "Ocean Recovery does not appear to be following a pattern of openness and honestly with either its proposed neighbors or the City." PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 1*41 .v C � 0 0 0 0 C 0 H J 3 C El 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 So Ocean Recovery as a history of not playing by the rules. They have been ordered by the City Building Department on several occasions, several occasions, to stop work on modifications of one of their properties that did not have the proper permits. In addition to Ocean Recovery's poor civic responsibility, the 1115 West Balboa location is too close to the existing approved Balboa Horizons location, which leads to the overconcentration and detrimental effects to the families living in the area and the character of the neighborhood. In reviewing the City's code requirements that were up there a few minutes ago that must be considered for this permit to happen, Ocean Recovery does not meet eight out of the eleven code requirements for approval. Given their history of playing games, I respectfully request that you deny Ocean Recovery this request for a permit at this location. Thank you. MR. MATHENA: Forgive me. This is sitting out front. But I just want to make absolutely sure, because it seems like nobody sees the chicken in -- the fox in the henhouse. In Ocean Recovery's submittal package, it's 43 of 85 in the PDF, their schedule, point blank, says that PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 53 OR 0310 M M 0 j 23 n 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 at 9:30 on Saturdays, they send people to the NA meeting on the beach at 15th. Period. So the three -year comment -- and I really do appreciate the reiteration of it for the record -- is false. And what also troubles me is, even though -- and I appreciate your comment -- we go to the effort to make this as explicitly clear as we can, and it's sitting out there, nobody's read it. So that's my first observation. My second observation is -- MR. ALLEN: I've read it. MR. MATHENA: Thank you. I appreciate that greatly, actually. My second observation is you have code violations. City knows about them. I checked with Code Enforcement. City doesn't choose to enforce them. City doesn't choose to turn them in. I don't understand why. Above and beyond that -- and, in fact, once you get to that point and once you accept that people are going to the beach, are going that playground, they are impacting or potentially may effect or be effected by the presence of this use at the elementary school. And I find it personally offensive that, sort of as a black line rule, we're attempting to say, oh, we can't consider the impact of this location of this use on the school. Just because you didn't have evidence or PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 54 OR 0311 0 0 E 0 E F] 0 11 0 M D 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 evidence you deemed important prior to this hearing doesn't mean it couldn't walk in kind of like it has, although it was there all along. I'm glad you read what I wrote, and I don't know want to waste time, then. To quickly hit some other points, 1601 is easy, if you go look at the facility. The patio where people I smoke, what it fronts is a 70 foot wide empty street. It's fortuitously in the right place. And, in fact, if you set up a zoning ordinance for these sorts of facilities that made them have a no -man's zone around them, it would make sense. That's not -- in fact, you have the exact opposite situation. I find it offensive, by the way, that the City says, oh, these are good operators. They don't know. Nobody at the City ever came and asked me what I thought until this hearing began. And in fact, the City went out of its way to discourage people's attendance as these things. Period. And it does so by scheduling a hearing. And if it gets too much data, it doesn't go to the same effort to change the hearing date that it did to initially publish it. And last point -- and actually, Paul, we'd be happy to have college students. And no, there was never more than two bodies to in any single bedroom in the nine PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 MIR OR 0312 0 U 0 C Z 0 121 E 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 years I've lived next door to this place. Period. So I think you have a clear path. MR. WETHERHOLT: Drew Weatherholt, resident of Newport Beach. Mr. Kiff, I do have to disagree with you regarding the cost of the burden, cost to the City of Newport Beach. Calls for police service may not be directed specifically to this property; however, if you look at calls per services in the surrounding area versus individuals loitering, the various crime issues, stuff of that nature, I think there clearly would be an impact. Just this past week, the police department passed out a yellow flier indicating that was there was theft and robbery activity in that surrounding area. Perhaps coincidence. Can you link it directly to this property? No, you cannot. But again, the coincidences keep piling up. Also, conversations with Hoag Hospital. Individuals at the ER department directly reflect that three to five people come from Newport Beach rehabs on a weekly basis. Can they disclose names? Can they complete statistics in that regards? No, again, because these people are protected by privacy laws and, obviously, the drug rehab aspects that are involved with them. Clearly there's an impact there with the fire PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 56 1 OR 0313 E 0 0 E 7 F7 0 F7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 services, medical services, emergency services. Conversations with local police officers. Please ask them. Just ask them. They deal with it on a daily basis. Is there a specific call or log for us? No, there may not be. But they have to deal with it on a regular basis. The beach main, which we have discussed here many times. I go to that park there on Newport E1 on a regular basis. Is it fair that my children have to listen to the words "fuck," "god damn it "? And I apologize. That',s not appropriate language for a meeting, but it's certainly not appropriate for a 3- year -old or a 5- year -old. Smoking is atrocious. Please, I welcome you to go down there anywhere between 9 and 11 o'clock on a Saturday and see what is taking place there. Many of those people at that meeting are walking down in the direction of this particular address. Best operator? I almost find that kind of humorous here. And we have an attorney that's making that representation? I'd like to see what creates the best operator of Newport Beach. The reduction of bed counts from 22 to 14. That's going to put them out of business? I'd like to see their financials to that effect. I'd like you to PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 57 OR 0314 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 request to see their corporate financials, corporate Federal tax returns and the individual tax returns for the operators of that organization. Because my rental properties receive $2500 per month. These guys are getting anywhere between $10- to $25,000 per head her bed on a quarterly basis. with that said, I'll recommend denial.. Thank you. MR. RUSH: Bob Rush. You said I could come up and finish what I was in the middle of saying, so I am going to take you up on that. On the issue of density, Mr. Kiff, good points. But if you really examine what he's saying, with respect, David, it flies in the face of the Fire and Building Code. Specifically identified in the last 24 months targeting rehab group homes and applied to the rehab homes, in particular, unfortunately, on -- fairly, this operator has been the target of more citations and -- more fireability citations than any other operator that I'm aware of. It has a portfolio. And these new rehab Fire and Building Codes are really -- if you look at them, their origins are based in density and use issues. And that's why they're so effective at calming new locations. And that's why the City went into the investigation mode, identified these PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 ®I OR 0315 J El 0 A 71 0 E 0 2) 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 things in State codes, and started applying them where they hadn't applied them in the last 24 months, I'd say 18. This operator, Mr. McCloskey, has one location that the amount of citations has delayed his opening of that location for a year and a half. So I really differ, and it flies in the face of what Mr. Riff says in that there is no cost. There is no burden difference. The burden difference is very subtle, but if you look at what the State does, you'll understand that these Fire and Building Codes are use and density driven, and so their use is -- I think it's prima facia evidence that there is a difference. There is a difference between the density of rehab and the density of vacation rentals. There is, clearly. Secondly, State laws. State laws in general around drug rehabs, if you look, they all predate Prop. 36's initial passage. They all predate 2000. And so a lot of the separation in density rules aren't there. And what does Mr. Kiff and the City Council, what have they done so far to kind of push that agenda? Nothing. There's not been one legal effort exerted to push that density definition, other than a trip up by a Councilman to have lunch with some legislators. But there's not been any legal actions to push the density PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 59 OR 0316 0 3 0 E'' 0 E7 E 0 0 0 U 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 question. And if you look at the different categories of group homes that are spatially dispersed under law -- of State code, you'll see that things like trauma homes and ambulatory care homes, where there's no mobility of the 'patients, they are mandated to be 700, 1,000 feet apart. And yet, we have highly mobile, highly capable type of rehab patient that's more of a burden to our area, and there's nothing there. The law hasn't clearly -- has not caught up with the post -Prop. 36 flood of otherwise prison inmates into our community. Thank you. MR. LOPEZ: Paul Lopez, 1125 1/2 West Balboa I Boulevard. Very personal item to me. I've lived next to this facility for five years. It's actually good to hear the operator speak tonight, because I think there's a pattern developing here, which I'm going to share some insights on, related to the staff report. And I'm going to read so I can try to fit in to three minutes. So as it relates to the operator's comments in the staff report, "The operator states that 1115 residents don't attend weekend Narcotics Anonymous meetings." Mr. Kiff, I think, fleshed that out quite PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a OR 0317 F] 0 Ej 21 0 C E M 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 adequately today. I've observed them sitting on my deck. I'm directly next door. They walk down the alley. I have followed them to the beach within the last three months. So three years versus three months. Something is wrong with the operator's potential memory. "The operator states that they discourage smoking at the facility," written in the staff report. There's no evidence of that. And, in fact, direct neighbors on the east, west and south side of 1115 have gone on record complaining about the amount of secondhand smoke that is being generated from this facility, and voicing their concerns over the families' health and restricted living environment it creates for their families. It is a fact that large groups of residents smoke daily in the courtyard and around that facility, both front and back. Immediate neighbors have also documented to the City their concerns related to the impact negative impact of this. To prove that the operator not being forthright on this issue with the neighbors and the City, up to 40 people, mostly guests, on Thursday night visit for a Thursday barbecue. There are more than 30 people smoking in the courtyard burdening the neighbors next door. I think the City needs to ask the operator to PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 6YSo OR 0318 0 0 7 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 is 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 explain his definition of discouraging smoking. Because they have already installed -- they just recently installed a tent over the courtyard smoking table to shield their smokers from getting wet during the recent rains. "The operator states that most of the residents don't have personal cars, but just a few that are in late stages of treatment." In fact, this evening, I just heard that there was one isolated incident of a car. This is not true. I believe you should have stated, "most residents have cars." Neighbors provided the City with personal observations, including pictures, that show 1115 residents are seen and heard at all times of the day or night in their personal vehicles. "Additional, the operator states there's a maximum of five cars parked for the Thursday night barbeque." This is not true. Thursday gatherings generate 30 to 40 people, most of these guests arrive by personal automobile. Anybody trying to park at the 1100 block on Thursday evening would see this. "The operator also states that local neighbors' observations and the unhealthy living environment is due to adverse behavior of the residents at 1129 West Balboa, PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 62 1 OR 0319 M C 0 Ell 0 El F7 EA 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 not his 1115 facility." This is absolutely not true. The record shows that all observed behaviors, code violations, secondhand smoke, offensive language, are emanating strictly from 1115 West Balboa Boulevard. The record is clear on this issue and substantiated by petition signatures, letters, and pictures that have been submitted to the City. Can I go on? I know my time is up. I just want to finish. , MR. ALLEN: It's not fair to the other people in case -- because I'm told we do have to leave at 6. And I don't know how many more people are going to talk. MR. LOPEZ: Can I make just one last comment? THE COURT: Sure. MR. LOPEZ: Okay. In the City's recommendations, and what appears to be rather arbitrary designation of West Balboa Boulevard as being some kind of dividing line for a block, the facility at 1132 that's already been approved by the City sits 80 feet from my residence. 1115 is 5 feet from my residence. That arbitrary designation, that somehow West Balboa Boulevard is a designation, I think dually unbiases this discussion that we're having right now. Because from a practical living standpoint, I've got two facilities -- PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 63 OR 0320 E 0 0 U 0 DI L E 0 0 C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 MR. ALLEN: You made that point really clear in your material. MR. LOPEZ: Can I ask one last question? MR. ALLEN: Yes. MR. LOPEZ: One last question. Did you see my pictures? MR. ALLEN: No. MR. LOPEZ: You haven't seen the pictures that I've submitted to Dave Kiff, 18 of them? MR. ALLEN: No, I have not. MR. KIFF: They are in your file, and here they are. You can thumb through them. MR. LOPEZ: Could you, please? UNKNOWN SPEAKER: Mr. Lopez can have my time. MR. ALLEN: Are they part of what was e- mailed to me? MR. KIFF: Yeah. MR. ALLEN: I didn't get through them. I will look at them before. MR. LOPEZ: Would you, please, because I think they kind of graphically represent -- can I have that woman's time? I'm able to have that? Is she able to designate her time to me? MR. ALLEN: We don't have any procedure or rules for these meetings, as I understand it. Take two PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 R OR 0321 ki 2 3 4 5 6 7 6 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 more minutes. MR. LOPEZ: Okay. So again, I just want to show a little bit of a pattern here by the operator. "The operator states" -- MR. ALLEN: Because you lived next door, you do have a vested interest here. Go ahead. MR. LOPEZ: I appreciate that. I've lived there for five years. "The operator states there's at least four staff members on site at the 1115." This is not true. Several local residents have gone on record questioning whether any staff is there during the day. "The operate states one man transports all 22 residents to off -site events and meetings." This is not true. In fact, the number of vans is at least two, and you'll see in your package there is a picture of the vans in the alleyway picking -- two vans picking up the residents. "Operate states curfew is 10 p.m. on weekdays and 12 o'clock on weekends, and lights are out at it o'clock." This is not true. Local residents have gone on record with observations that residents are coming and going on bikes and cars at all hours of the night well PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 65 OR 0322 El 0 0 L 0 0 n J J 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 past any of these stated times. Rarely are lights ever out at this facility. And then finally, the overconcentration issue, which I think is a big one. I talked about kind of the arbitration assignment of West Balboa Boulevard. I've got two recommended approvals. One approved facility, one being recommended by the City staff. That's going put two facilities within 80 feet of my residence. And we've submitted in our package documentation that the residents at 1115 are in interacting back and forth with the apartment complex at 1120. MR. ALLEN: You've gotten all that documented well in your -- MR. LOPEZ: Thank you. MR. ALLEN: -- material. MR. LOPEZ: I very respectively request denial of the application. MS. DARLING: Hi. My name is Colleen Darling, and I'm the owner of the property at 1113. MR. ALLEN: Spell the last name, please? MS. DARLING: D- a- r- l- i -n -g. MR. ALLEN: Thank you. MS. DARLING: I've owned the property for 13 years, and I lived there before I had children, when it PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 H' OR 0323 0 F] J 0 0 El L71 r 7 M 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 was a residential apartment house. There was never the amount of people that you had stated there. At the most, there was two people in every apartment, which was a normal apartment. And there were two studios. And even with them not hitting any kind of code, the people that lived in the single places were totally respectful of the neighborhood. They were nice to be with, and we all used to hang out and have a great i time. When the facility moved in next door, I moved out. I've got two tenants now, and I rent the houses. And I've got to tell you something. It's pretty hard to tell somebody that you can have a house in Newport Beach and live next to a recovery home. I experienced it firsthand last year. We were there for six months. And the hours of use? The noise? I went to that fence many times, because my kids' bedroom is right on that corner. 10:30, 11, 12 o'clock at night, there's guys out smoking. They are drumming their hands. They are singing. They are talking. And then they all go in when you go in. And when you say something, then you hear the door slam. And they're aluminum doors, and they said, "Well, we'll take care of it. We'll put closers on it." See the guy the next day, and he said, "You know what? PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 [Yll OR 0324 0 0 0 G 7 J C C C U C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 It's kind of expensive. We're going to do our best." So then they are in their houses, and the windows are all open. I can't open my window at night when it's 90 degrees last summer because the TVs are blarring. And it's not that the TV was off at 12 o'clock. That TV is on all night long. And those people are up and about at 6 o'clock in the morning, because that's when they start their day. It's not 8 o'clock. Never did I experience no noise until 8 o'clock. They have got the talking, the drumming, the doors slamming. We can't open our windows. We can't have a life down there, and that's not fair. I have two little girls who deserve to have freedom at the beach, and they can't do that because of what's next door to me. The trash, we've addressed that. We've addressed the flies. My tenants can't go out on the patio because of the Thursday meetings. They don't know who's next door. They both have girls, also. The guy across the wall talk to the girls next door. They are like 12 and 16 years old and really pretty. You know what? The mother's experienced it. She's like, "I don't know who these people are. I don't want them talking to me." So we've seen it firsthand. You know, you mentioned the other building PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 al OR 0325 ZI 0 E In 11 E 0 IM 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 that's going to be at Bay 1129. Why do we have to wait six months? I experienced it last year. I called the City when the place was going to happen in the beginning, and they said, "There's nothing we can do. It's going to be discriminatory, and the Federal government says we have to allow this." So I do thank you for at least putting some practices in that we can maybe move forward and get some of these places cleaned up. You mentioned a reduction of income of 36 percent? If I lose one tenant, I lose 50 percent. If I lose two, I lose 100 percent. That's doesn't help me at all. So, you know, looking at your side saying 36 percent, I lose a lot. I've got a vacant property, which becomes a nuisance to Newport Beach. And the reason I live in Newport was because it was a beautiful place. I ,moved from back East, and I landed in Newport. I thought it was the greatest city in the world. I want you guys to see if you can keep it that way. My suggestions with the smoking, which is just ridiculous, there's smokeless ashtrays. Build a wall between my house. I've got a pony wall like this high, and then goes up to four or five feet higher. Build a wall that's 8 for 10 feet high. I don't want to see your PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 N OR 0326 7 V L P.'1 G 0 U 0 H H, C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 is 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 people. Put some greenery there. Put some big trees that absorb some of the smoke. We don't want it. Maybe it will help absorb some of the noise. So I thank you. MR. WOOD: My name is Douglas Wood. My family has lived in Newport Beach for 60 years. My wife's family, even longer. I want to talk about one issue, and that's the overconcentration of these properties. If you place that chart to North, Mr. Allen -- MR. ALLEN: Sir? MR. WOOD: Did you get a chart? MR. ALLEN: I was just handed the chart, yes. MR. WOOD: Right. If you look at that chart, place it North, see "North" at the top left side? MR. ALLEN: Yes. MR. WOOD: My property is at 1119. It's the one than outlined in green, okay? And beside it at 1111 is a property that's been identified by the City as being a rehab home. And then you go directly behind my house at 1119, 1132 is a rehab home. And if you go toward the east, 1120 is a rehab home. And if you go across the street, the 1115 and 1129 are there. And if you go to the west, beyond.12th Street, there's 1217 and 1216. This is clearly an overconcentration of rehab PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 70 OR 0327 S [3 El F R Eel 0 7 Ri E-11 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 facilities in this area, and this application and any others in that area should be denied. I thank you. MR. ALLEN: Thank you. MS. CURRAN: My name a Laura Curran. I live in .Corona Del Mar. MR. ALLEN: Spell the last name, please. MS. CURRAN: C- u- r- r -a -n. MR. ALLEN: Thank you. MS. CURRAN: I go to the beach frequently, and there are also group residential facilities in Corona Del Mar, so this hearing creates precedents, so those are my interests. First, I want to talk about my own personal perspective and then ask to provide some comments from a neighbor. Why does the City not site it for violations, such as the garage use? Why are we considering approval with conditions when we've shown -- when the operator has shown they can't control inappropriate behavior and . violates codes, specifically the use of the garage for assembly and other uses. This is a use that happens here and happens in other group homes facilities in part to support smoking. So if the operator is currently using the garage for an illegal use, why has the City not stopped it before, and PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 71 E u E3 71 D 0; D a n E R3 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 what confidence do we have that we are going to continue to comply with the revised terms of permit stated on page 6 and further in the document? Further, related to Exhibit 1, item eight, smoking and tobacco products, I'm trying to understand what it says. "Smoking on -site shall be restricted to a designated area interior to the facility or an area enclosed on all sides but open to the sky to prevent secondhand smoke from impacting adjacent residents." Now, if the smoke goes to the sky from all sides, aren't we outside or, de facto, experiencing the same activity? So I would like some clarification and a firm understanding that this is interior smoking in a room which is a part of the residence. I was also asked to reiterate input from a resident who lives approximate to this facility. I'll identify her as a mother with children, and I'll just exert. This person moved into recently and has issues, such as loitering. And I'll quote. It says, "As I come home with my children in tow, we have a rather rough looking person standing in our yard smoking his cigarette as if he lives there. As we park, he continues to remain on our steps smoking a cigarette. We have to walk through side stream smoke to get to our front door. It's an intimidating and PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 72 OR 0329 1 Q Z 71 7 C R 11 21 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 unhealthy situation." Loud noises and profanity. This person discusses, "I lay in bed listening to groups of people talking, laughing, yelling, coughing, banging, televisions blarring, in and out of doors, just beyond the bedroom windows, and this happens to the children." Paraphrasing, "When my school children ask about -- tell me about it, they say they fall asleep listening to the neighbors every night. And this is a especially disruptive on schools nights." Again, related to the smoke. "Constant smoking next door has prohibited my children from be able to play in the backyard, which is a part of our property. When someone goes outside to smoke, we are required to send our children inside, so that they are not affected by the smoke again." Finally, this person wants to reiterate that, "Newport Elementary School is in close proximity to this and many like kind facilities, which the City has allowed to operate. This is not right and poses an unnecessary danger to children. It is within close proximity to other facilities of like kind and other situations the City has allowed to occur." Again, this resident and others ask that you deny this permit. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 73 OR 0330 71 u N C E G 0 C 71 Lill H_ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 Thank you. MS_ VERDUGO: Hi. I'm not quite sure the set up. I've never spoken at a City meeting. I live adjacent to 1115 West Balboa. MR. KIFF: Your name, please? MS. VERDUGO: Christine Verdugo. And I -- basically, I'm not up here to discuss real specific issues. I've submitted a letter that is in your package. I wanted to just come face -to -face with you and just make sure that you are going to review everything in the packages that you've received on this before coming to a determination so that you can see everybody's story. Because I think three minutes per person is really not enough time to give you all the information that you might need to make a decision, which obviously, from a general perspective, is side stream smoke, loitering, language, intimidation, age- inappropriate contact, waving at the children over the fence, handing cake -- birthdays cake over to my children to bring it the home. It's a problem. I did want to clarify directly to you that it is misleading to put on record that 1129 has any direct effect on the situation that's going on at this property. Okay. Please look at that as a separate issue and then PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 74 OR 0331 1 0 1 Q El 0 0 0 0 F] 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 the issues that are brought up in our letters and our comments that are directed to this property. Certainly we live there. We can tell you if we see direct contact between the two properties. Not that they don't come into contact with each other, but the issues that we're complaining about are specific to this location. I did also want to make a note about the misleading date of the hearing. The signs that are all posted all over the City state, you know, the February 5th, or whenever the initial date was. So an interested party walking by the home could still see the 5th on the 7th and think they missed the hearing, when, in fact, the here was still upcoming and would have an opportunity to come to the meeting. So they are misled in that sense. Again, I'm just a little bit nervous. I apologize. I ask that you please read all the information in the record and make a determination using your leadership, which I've seen a lack of within the City. And I feel very offended that my letter is being used to build conditions that they would be using to abide by, rather than using it as my defense in helping you find a way to stop it altogether. And I feel also offended that we have to suffer PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 75 1 OR 0332 0 [7 0 0 0 n F] El 0 El El 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 is 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 while they figure out the solution to the problems. So while he's stated specifically they don't have a solution to the side stream smoke specifically, and da, da, da, we're going to sit around breathing it every day while you decide what you're going to do. And I don't think that's right either, because every second that we breathe it, we have consequences from that specifically. So I think the solution, based on the overconcentration -- I mean, this guy is naming 1111, 1132, 1217: 1 mean, how many more do we have to have in one specific area? We pay a lot of money -- and we don't own. We're not wealthy. We don't own. We.go -- we live here for the schools for our kids. So we want to -- we're willing to pay a higher price to have a nice area, and I think that's just too many people congregating in that !demeanor. So thank you. MR. BUNCH: Good evening. My name is Ray Bunch. I'm the husband of Colleen Darling. We're the owners of the 1113 building next door to 1115. And I wanted to give you my perspective when we stayed there this summer. It may be a little bit different than you've already heard. I see this business next door to us that is PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 76 OR 0333 0 M 0 0 F] 3 i 0 E, u 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 doing their rehab, which is obviously a fine thing and a needed thing. It turns out this is a beautiful area, and it's a very -- I see it as a very attractive place to draw clients to, knowing that they are going to be near the beach, and it's a good selling point. But that means we have a business next to our property. And instead of apartment buildings with separate individuals that would stay there on a regular basis, what we're getting is people that are cycling through. Now, these people are -- I don't know the exact conditions of why they there are, whether it's drug rehab, or alcoholism, or what have you, but in not knowing that, that's a little concern being a parent. And knowing that there's guys coming through on a regular basis -- I don't know their histories, I don't know, you know, they are right next door -- there's a little bit of a fear that comes with that. And, you know, it's a home, you know. It's where you have your family, and that shouldn't be there. In a place where there's more room and less, you know, less concentrated than Newport Beach, especially along the boulevard there, I can see having something like that. But when the quarters are so close together, so confined, I mean, where there's just a short PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 77 OR 0334 2 0 La F1 F3 0 a 1113 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 wall away, and guys are leaning over saying hi to my daughters, is not okay with me. So this is just a small example of what could possibly -- what has gone on there. So what could happen? I don't want to even consider that. But having those people cycle through, we've already covered the smoke and the noise, and all the other uncomfortable things of it. But I think just because it's an attractive and it's good for their business, it's not necessarily good for us, which is the homeowners. All right. That's all I need to say. MS. OBERMAN: Denys Oberman. First, I'd like to say that Mr. McCloskey has always been personally courteous to me in the times that I have seen him, which is not been whenever I've experienced incidents from his residence. I do have a number of questions that I'd like to address to you, and perhaps you can address them to Mr. McCloskey and get answers. First of all, this is a large facility by any standard. Who is the on -site manager? Is there one? That's my first question. I'd like to get an answer. Shall I just go through what I want to say, Mr. Allen? I need some direction here. Okay. So PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 78' OR 0335 0 0 0 0 0 U C E A 21 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 that's the first question. MR. ALLEN: I mean, if you asked those questions, then I hope we can get them and I hope the Applicant is listening. MS. OBERMAN: Okay. Who is the on -site manager, and is that manager, in fact, on -site? Secondly, there is evidence of people going from 1115 West Balboa to 1120 West Balboa. There is a going back and forth. We'd like to know, what is 1120 west Balboa? There is clearly a relationship between that physical facility and the people in it and 1115. Thirdly, we'd like to know -- we do believe that Mr. McCloskey, in certain respects, is trying to be a better operator than others. Having said that, the law is very clear in saying that institutionalization overconcentration is bad for the people seeking legitimate recovery. So, we ask why is Mr. McCloskey intent on establishing another facility, which would be the third facility within a thousand feet, at 1217 West Bay in (addition to the facility at 1115? And those two facilities are within 200 to 250 feet of one another, contributing to overconcentration. So that is a bad business decision, because it creates a rehab community, which is institutionalization. So we don't understand PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 79 OR 0336 E I 0 0 L 0 A 0 0 D 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 that, and it's bad for his clients. Lastly, we have not observed any evidence of significant adverse impact from 1601. There are significant adverse impacts from 1115. And we feel it may be worthwhile to consider these as two uses to be considered and approved individually or denied on a conditional basis rather than commingling them. That may make the best use management for the City and may be the more equitable thing to the operator as well. So we request that 1115 be denied, and we are comfortable with 1601 West Balboa being approved. Thank you. MR. ALLEN: Any more who would like to speak? MR. MYERS: Can I have 10 seconds? MR. ALLEN: Pardon? MR. MYERS: Can I have 10 seconds? MR. ALLEN: Sure. MR. MYERS: Jeff Myers, M- y- a -r -s. I want to say that we value the rehab effort that they are doing. This particulAr location, 1115, they don't own that facility. We don't wish them a financial hardship. We just wish them to move to a more adequate location. Thank you. MR. ALLEN: Okay. Anyone else want to say PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 0 OR 0337 M C C J 0 J 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 anything? Okay. Then -- is it compelling, and did you not write it? MR. LOPEZ: I didn't write it, I don't think. Paul Lopez. I just wanted to make note in the staff report that when we talked about the box without a ceiling on it for smoking -- I don't know how you defined it -- is that you recognize that on all three sides of the building are buildings that are actually taller than the 1115 facility. So if you shoot smoke up in the air, you're shooting in the master bedrooms of three different facilities. Okay. Thanks. MR. ALLEN: Thanks. Okay. Let's close the public hearing then, and bring back -- let's see. It's 10 minutes to 6. We're required to stop at 6, and we have some questions to respond to, and I think the Applicant should respond to some of these comments as well. Mr. Kiff, do you have a recommendation as to what direction we might take here? MR. KIFF: As I noted earlier, I think a number of the very specific concerns, and you heard them again today, need to appropriately be addressed. we actually PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 FT■ OR 0338 D7 H F7 F7 (7 7 0 0 Lei 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 could try to address them until maybe about 6:15. The Planning Commission meets at 6:30. We need to give them a little bit of time to set up, if that were amenable to you. And then maybe see how we do, and then you can use your judgment, if you feel like too many things are unaddressed, which may, indeed, be. So your choice, Mr. Allen. I can comment on a number of things that have been said. Maybe it's better to let the Applicant do that first, and then I can follow up maybe with some questions of them as well. MR. ALLEN: I think that's a good idea, and I don't mind spending the extra time if we have the location. MR. KIFF: We've just talked to the Planning Commission secretary. There's no meeting. we can go a little longer, then. MR. ALLEN: There seems to be one disconnect that keeps coming up here, from my perspective, and that is that there's contentions that there hasn't been staff involvement, and why have these garages been used for assembly uses and not parking. And the question becomes, has the City received a lot of complaints about this? And I realize that that's a wide open question. But I'd just be interested in trying to understand the difference between the PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 F-I OR 0339 3 El u F L Ell S C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 observations of all of these people that have gotten up and spoken and the seeming lack of records or information about responses to the complaints. MR. RIFF: I can offer a couple of comments there, Mr. Allen, maybe because that may address some of the questions that came up, including one from Ms. Curran about noting that in the staff report, we cite that -- we note that there are at least two ongoing Code violations that have been occurring at this facility and at 1601, and that is the conversion of garages to non - parking uses, and then assembly uses on -site. And we do operate Code enforcement on a complaint basis. So we're not out -- we do some inspections on other own that are obvious to us, illegal signs, a hedge that, for instance, is a potential hazard in terms of line of sight for cars, trash violations, and things like that. But a number of them, it does take someone to call in and say, "Hey, look. This is what's happening at my neighbor's house," and we go out and do an inspection. I oversee Code enforcement, and this was one that either we weren't contacted about or we genuinely missed. And I tried to note that in the staff report these are violations that should have been Corrected. And I believe, had they come to our attention earlier, we PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800)1647-9099 OR 0340 13 0 :A F] 0 U 0 7 0 0 J 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 would have districted that they be corrected. So that's an error on our part. I will state, though, that these are common -- one of them, converting a garage, is a very common violation. And we don't penalize the homeowner beyond -- we start with a notice of violation that has no monetary fine. We'll say, you know, you've got to convert that back. You've got to clean out the stuff that's in there so you can park two cars. It's very common in Newport Beach. It's very common in many beach communities, So I don't think it's fair to pick on Ocean Recovery for something that we don't pick on everybody for and /or when they'make the remedy, they are good. Similar to the correction that Mr. Myers brought up, we have all kinds of trash in the alley violations. We have hundreds a year. So is it a violation? Definitely. Is it unfair to penalize Ocean Recovery for a violation that happens all the time with other folks? Yes, I think it is unfair. And that's why we did develop a condition to say, "Look, no more of this. You have a lot of trash. You need a cover." But I also know that our General Services Department doesn't allow you to put a cover on there if you've got a plastic bin, and you leave it out PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 H OR 0341 El FA R, [7 C MI J 11 '7 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 the night before. And, arguably, they leave it out too early. So one of the conditions does direct them to go to a bin service with a cover with collection during the day on a weekday, when hopefully not a lot of folks are around to hear the trash truck come by. So with that, I'll stop talking and maybe you have further questions. MR. ALLEN: I think it would be good idea if the Applicant would come forward and try to address some of these issues as well. MR. MC CLOSKEY: Sure. Again, Jim McCloskey. We have tried to address, first off, the trash issue, which Dave was talking about. We did go to a trash can with a lid to try to take care of the noise. And we actually got cited for it the way Dave just mentioned. So I know a lot of these things are difficult, but we've tried to do it. There are no more barbeques. There's no more outings at either facility, so those are gone. We have enacted that ourselves. Thursday meetings are gone. MR. ALLEN: I'm sorry. You said there's no more barbeques, no more assemblies. And then you said something like alleys or what? PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 85 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 MR. MC CLOSKEY: From this point forward, we're no longer having the barbeques or assemblies, so it's dismissed. It's gone. The other thing I'd probably like to address that got mentioned is the trips to Hoag Hospital. You know, there's a difference between what we do and maybe what some of other rehabs do. What some of the other rehabs do is what's caused primary care. Primary care means to get involved in detox, which is a more direct situation where people are more susceptible to having to have emergency service. we do not do that. In order for them to come to our facility, they have to have some mobility and some stability within their program. So to my knowledge, Kevin, correct me if I'm wrong, have we ever had anybody had to go to Hoag Hospital? There's nobody from our facility that's ever had -- for medical reasons had to go to Hoag Hospital for an emergency situation. So that kind of differs us a little bit. We talked about the Thursday meetings. Our managers are on -site. The person that runs 1115 West Balboa, Karen Knab, as I mentioned before, she's a master level -- has a Master education. Worked for Hazelton, which is one of the largest rehab PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a Kallcr, 91 0 3 E E E 0 0 E) 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/1212009 facilities in the country. We were lucky to get her from that facility. So -- and there is somebody there 24/7. There's supervision during the day. Our -- I'm sorry. During the week, there is at least three people there; sometimes there's four people there. We can address that. And there is somebody. We do have supervision 24/7 there. MR. ALLEN: Ms. Oberman specifically asked the identity of the on -site manager. MR. MC CLOSKEY: Karen Knab. MR. ALLEN: And that's Karen Knab, K- n -a -b? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Yes, correct. UNKNOWN LADY: Can we make a comment? MR. ALLEN: No, not now, thanks. MR. MC CLOSKEY: The other issue I'd like to address is the recommendation to we build a wall or build plants in between the two facilities. We'd be more than willing to do that or consider that if the City would allow us to do that. We're willing to make changes. So we're open up to the suggestions on that. MR. ALLEN; What about the question about what is 1120 West Balboa? I don't know what the connection is? MR. MC CLOSKEY: We have no affiliation with PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 87 OR 0344 0 n 0 J (✓ 0 a 0 E E gQ 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 a 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 it. It's not ours. We don't own it. We don't control it. I tried to do -- I just found out about this. One of the things that is perplexing to us or hard for us is we are just learning about some of these today. Myself, I just learned about some of them_ So some of them I don't have all the answers to. I tried to find out about 1120. Is that what it was? MR. ALLEN: I thought that's what Ms. Oberman I said. MR. MC CLOSKEY: It's not ours. I tried to. I could be that there was some friends that were visiting there, but it's not our facility. We don't have any affiliation with that facility or that residence. MR. KIFF: So, Mr. McCloskey, to put a finer point on that, then, you don't know about anybody operating 1120? MR. MC CLOSKEY: I'm going to say we have nothing to do with it. I haven't had a chance to fully research it to find out who is in there, and what's going on, if our clients -- if they are friends, or what relationship our people have in there, but that is not our facility. MR. KIFF: I would note, Mr. Allen, for the record, the City is not aware of whether 1120 was or is operated as a group residential use. If it is, it's PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 al OR 0345 9 0 0 U 0• I D U 0 sl 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 subject to abatement in 13 days or 11 days. And similarly, Mr. Wood's map, he brought up another address, 1111 West Bay. I was not aware that that was being used as a group residential use. It's not on our list, but that would be subject to abatement in it days as well, just like 1129. THE REPORTER: Paper, please? (Pause in proceeding.) MR. MC CLOSKEY: You know, the last thing that I forgot to mention was the NA meeting. That's actually in our clients', for lack of a better word, daily routines. In my haste -- I'm going to take a fall for that. In my haste, I actually grabbed a very old calendar that we used. Again, our clients do not go to that NA meeting. It's not part of our program. We do not send them there, and they do not go there, so -- MR. ALLEN: That's the meeting where they talked about walking up to the 15th Street? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Yeah, on the beach. MR. ALLEN: Yeah. MR. MC CLOSKEY: It is a very large meeting. Our clients do not go there. We have no control of it, and we are not associated with it. MR. ALLEN: And you don't encourage your PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a OR 0346 A [U Ck n Cal [7 0 0 C E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 residents to attend that meeting? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Absolutely not. In fact, we discourage them and tell them that they are not allowed. MS. BROWN: Why is it on the schedule? MR. MC CLOSKEY: Again, as I said, it's my error. In the haste to get this into our workup, I actually grabbed an old schedule that was there from quite some time ago. So that was actually my error. UNKNOWN PERSON: I quit. UNKNOWN PERSON: What about the eyewitness account? MR. KIFF: I'm trying to think of what questions -- Ms. Oberman asked two more. One of them was more, I think, directed to the City. Do we consider these two application independent? And we do, which is why they are set up on the same day but they are two separate agenda items. And then her other question was, why establish 1217 west Bay? - MR. MC CLOSKEY: All I can tell you about 1217 is that it's not operational. It has not been. We've owned that property for two years. MR. KIFF: I guess that would allow me to make a couple of comments based on what Mr. Rush said. We did follow that 1217 West Bay property closely, PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 0 OR 0347 A 11 C M G n C 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 because -- and it's a little different from what folks may understand. Remember, if you're starting a new facility today and seeking an ADP license, and you're seeking one for more than six people, you do need a fire clearance. And the fire clearance applies to the Codes in effect at the time you ask. And the Codes change nearly every two years. So the Codes become more and more challenging each time they get updated and, in some cases, more and more protective of what they call group residential use or group residential occupancies. And it doesn't always distinguish between someone's ambulatory ability and non - ambulatory ability. We don't think that makes a lot of sense, but the Codes are the way the Codes are. So with Mr. McCloskey's facility at 1217 West Bay, I believe the initial application was for eight people in this facility. And it involved what the Fire Department believes was a three -story building, because of split levels and lofts, which a different level of Code standard apply. And I don't know if you've ever read the Fire Code, but it's highly complex. Even the Fire Marshal struggles with it. But we believe we acted fairly at PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 91 OR 0348 [1 0 J A 0 P, n L 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 1217 West Bay. And then eventually, because the bed count was dropped to six, we were able to sign off on a fire clearance at that location. MR. ALLEN: Okay. Any other comments or questions here? Okay. Thank you. MR. KIFF: Mr. Allen, I'll give you a number of potential answers to questions folks raised. They don't involve Mr. McCloskey. Forgive me. I'm just going to go through my notes here a little bit. I think I addressed how we would deal with Code violations. In some cases, they're relatively minor and happen all the time throughout the City. They are still important to us, but many times we rely on people to report things to us. I did want to touch on something Mr. Mathena spoke about, and that is the definition of a block, basically. He didn't quite phrase it that way, but in the APA standard, we talked about one or two uses per block. Now, our Ordinance defines what an block is. And a block is an area bounded by streets. Now, if you look on the board there, our interpretation of this has been an area bounded by streets and /or the boardwalk or the sand, in some cases. PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 92 OR 0349 A C C A 0 C ['+`_. a U 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 That the block, in this case where Ocean Recovery sits, is the 1100 block of West Balboa in the odd numbered section. And it also would include those ;properties that face Ocean Front West. Now, the definition of the block also allows you to stretch that out. It doesn't allow you, unless you specifically choose to do so, and I would -- staff would argue it's not the appropriate interpretation -- it doesn't allow you to draw a circle around something and go 617 feet. It allows you to stretch out a rectangle. And the rectangle is restarted again when you cross a street. Again, the definition of the block is in the Ordinance. It's as defined. We even, at one point, had a diagram showing what a block was. So I wanted to make sure. I don't think it's arbitrary at all. It's based on the Ordinance. I'm going to keep going through some of my notes. I do think that the number of times folks have brought up that beach meeting -- and I'll stress it once again, I think that's something the City needs to address. I don't think it's appropriate to shoulder that burden on one operator, because I've been told people from throughout the region attend that meeting. What the PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a OR 0350 A 0 C 1] A a U A I'll 0 A 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 City will have to do -- and I know Council Member Henn has spoke about doing this -- is to require special event permits for things like that, so we can more appropriately regulate them. Today, the only special event that requires a special event permit on the beach is things like large surf events. I think we even had a threshold of the amount of people that are in that type of meeting. So we may have to ratchet that down. Because I think the loitering is a problem, and breaking in law and smoking is definitely a problem. So that message has been heard. We need a change the Ordinance and fix that. I wanted to address one thing that Ms. Verdugo brought up, and I apologize. She noted that she was offended that her letter was used to build conditions. It wasn't just her letter, and conditions are built to address -- conditions for use permits are built to address concerns raised because of that use. And I do very sincerely want folks in the audience to understand that people in recovery are a protected class and entitled to fair housing opportunities. And that is why the Ordinance was written the way it was written. It didn't say we can never have any recovery homes in Newport Beach anymore. It doesn't say they PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 94 OR 0351 E I 0 E z J 71 0 C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 couldn't be in any residential district. Because Court cases up and down the nation have shown that they need to be allowed in residential districts because this is their home. So whether it's a business operating in a residential district, it sure is. You're right. But we're clearly directed by law to allow that in a residential district. What our Ordinance tried to do -- and you're right. And probably two years ago when you would have called and said, hey, we can't do anything. What we decided to do was change that mindset and said, maybe we can do something. Maybe we can address the secondary impacts of a overconcentration of homes. And that's what led to the Ordinance's adoption more than a year ago. What you're seeing is the consequences of that Ordinance. It gave folks until February 22nd to either file for a use permit and get one or leave. And cities across the state, and even across the nation, are looking at this Ordinance to see if it survives. We're committed to trying to implement it fairly, and "fairly" includes allowing folks in recovery to continue to reside in Newport Beach, but to address the secondary impacts of those residences, to make sure PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 95 OR 0352 Ll 0 0 0 0 C 0 23 "2 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 that people around them are protected to the maximum extent practicable. We're hopeful this Ordinance succeeds is doing that. An Ordinance is a device written by humans, and so it has human error in it. So, thus, you can see all the struggles we've been going with in crafting conditions. With that, as we're approaching 6:15, Mr. Allen, I'd be interested in some of your thoughts. I guess I'd offer one thing. I think there's enough uncertainty in this, especially as it relates to 1129, and that certainly a lot of encouraging comments, I think -- maybe that's not the right word -- by the Applicant to try to resolve things that I'm reluctant to ask you to issue a use permit based on the staff's recommendation. What I'd rather do, I imagine, is if there was a way we can continue this action and have a period of time where the Applicant could prove that they could live by those conditions, maybe it's -- maybe it's six months. Then we come back. And then the assurance that we have is that something is not issued today, there isn't a guarantee of this operator's ability to stay, until we pass through that six -month period with compliance or not, and with potentially the removal of 1129 from the picture and, PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 am OR 0353 C F11 C 0 Q u D 9 El S 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 gosh, maybe 1120 across the street, and the other ones that didn't apply, and use that as a test period to see whether or not this application is worthy of being approved or denied at that point. MR. ALLEN: Well, I think that's worth consideration. This is a very difficult one. It's just wrought with issues, you know. Sheppard Mullin saying that the Ordinance isn't enforceable, it's unconstitutional, but we want to work with you. The Applicant also says that they can abide by most of the conditions here. The most compelling issue, obviously, is the number of beds that are permitted. The neighbors say that this is a verbal nuisance; that there's a series of problems. And it clearly is a problem from their perspective, given the tight dense relationship. Mr. Mathena, Mr. Lopez and their families live within 5 feet of it. And I think it was an interesting comment by one gentleman that you just don't know these people, because they are here today and gone 90 days later. I am not persuaded it's a good idea to issue a use permit at this time, because it becomes a vested right for this organization. Because once that happens, that permit vests. And despite -- the recommendation of staff is to do that. I just don't think it's a good PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 a OR 0354 Z 0 0 0 0 S 0 0 M El S 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 idea. And Mr. Kiff is maybe beginning to go that direction as well. Because revocation of a use permit is a very difficult thing. And Mr. Mathena tried to quantify it or asked us to quantify that in one of his communications. And frankly, you just virtually can't do that, because it's such a wide range of issues, and the degree of which due process is granted in going forward, with the time involved in doing it, it's just a very difficult undertaking. So I much prefer to see us do, as you alluded to, Mr. Kiff, and continue this for -- the recommendation was to issue the use permit and then have it reviewed in six months. I'd rather see us -- unless there's some compelling issue here from the Applicant where it's unacceptable, in which event, then, we have to make some real hard decisions here -- that we continue it for six months. And I don't know that we can set a date certain, but we do a noticed hearing at that time. And there certainly has been some grumbling about the fact that we do a noticed hearings and then continue them. So let's make it certain when we do it. But to reopen the hearing in six months, and see the extent to which the Applicant has been able to PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 al OR 0355 E 0 71 M_ 0 Cl 0 0 El D 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 live with these conditions. And so we're getting out of time. The hard issue that gets put to me is, how many beds? And if they can't make it with 14 beds, it makes no sense to restrict them to 14 beds and then see if they can otherwise comply with conditions, because they are not going to be there. And that might be beneficial to the neighbors, but certainly not to them. So I'm not any more able to know what that right number is than anyone else, but I think I'm there. And it just seems to me that 16 is one that works, But do you have a recommendation in that respect, Mr. Kiff? MR. KIFF! I was wrestling with that, too. And we talked in the staff recommendation about coming back in six months and potentially allowing an increase if -- an increase for good behavior. To me, it may make more sense to see if ocean !Recovery can succeed in addressing all of these concerns, all of the conditions that are proposed, maybe through an Operations and Management Plan, which I think would be (good to see back from them in two weeks for this six -month period. But there's two schools of thought. One is that the beds should be reduced. The other is the beds PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 01 OR 0356 El 23 N E [7 E 2 2] n H E 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 should be at a level that they suggest they can operate at, and we can make them prove they can operate at that level. And if they suggested 18 beds, I think that's arguably more challenging for them to show that they can manage that within these conditions. So maybe they need to be careful what they wish for, because I do want to really see how this operation may succeed or fail at the level that it says that they say they need to operate on. MR. ALLEN: So this presents us with some pretty difficulty issues, because we say continue it for six months and comply with all the issues. And yet, we don't really have the legal force in place to compel it the way I would see that here, because we don't have the Resolution adopted. So the question becomes, are you willing to live with this process? And we really do have to get out of here, I guess. But would you be willing to attempt to do that, and not -- I guess the City could open up a hearing in a shorter period of time, I mean, if things went wild there. But what is your thought? MR. O'CONNOR: I think the short answer is we'd be willing to work along the lines of Mr. Kiff's suggestion. We've heard a lot of things tonight. As.I PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 100 1 OR 0357 F] J A E 0 0 0 Ell _,, 0 C 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 mentioned, we're hearing this for the first time. As we're hearing some of these suggestions made as to how we could become a better operator, Mr. McCloskey and I have been nodding each other, saying, "Let's try that." For example, when Mrs. Darling came up here and made some suggestions about what we would do to control secondhand smoke, we looked at each other saying, "That's a good idea. Let's give that a shot." So we would be willing to try to implement these procedures and come back in a period of time, six months sounds reasonable to me, in an attempt to show that we can, in fact, comply with these suggested conditions. In terms of the bed count, I think that 18 is a number that is manageable. It is, coincidentally enough, the mid -point between our currently licensed 22 and the 14 that was recommended in the conditions that are part of the staff report. So I think that 18 is a good number. I do note Mr. Kiff's comment that that may presented more challenges to us, but we're willing to (show you that we can make it work. I would like to note and ask those in attendance to work with us as well, and I hope that we're PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 101 OR 0358 R. n 0 a El 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 not being set up for failure here. Because I can assure you, and Mr. McCloskey will do the same, that you will see legitimate efforts on our part to make this better. And I don't want to have this a situation where we're just giving the people that, if there are people that fall in this category, will be against us no matter what we do an opportunity to come back again. MR. ALLEN: Well, of course, you can't control that. If they are against you, they will stay against you. But hopefully, they can get work. And if there's lines of communication that can be set up and workable, then that's all the better. There's the discussion about -- it's not peer group, it's the vested -- the stakeholders' organization, Maybe there's a communication line that can be set up in that manner. MR. KIFF: Let me try to pull together maybe a recommendation for your consideration, Mr. Allen, in that we do believe this probably needs to be continued to a date certain, with the understanding that we could call it earlier, as you noted, if things were untenable. And that six months is August 12th, if my math is correct. And during that time, we would obligate the operator and enter into an agreement providing that they would agree to an Operations and Management Plan based on PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 102 OR 0359 E 0 0 El E IA S Y1 0 0 J 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 the conditions. I wanted to make sure we don't have a violation of the Permit Streamlining Act, too. We would -- this would be a mutual consent.by yourself and your client to not state that this is a delay in the City's operations. It would be a violation of Permit Streamlining Act by continuing the hearing for six months. So we want to see that that protection was in there. And that the bed count be 18, because I think that is be careful what you wish for. And that that Operations and Management Plan be brought back to us at a staff level, which we'll make available to the public, and talk to you about within two weeks. Because I think it's pretty clear what needs to be done. MR. O'CONNOR: I think that all.sounds reasonable. I.might request a little breathing room on the two weeks for the following two reasons: Number one, I'm going to be out of state all of next week on vacation, not that my personal schedule should burden everyone else's, but I do envision myself having an active role in this. And number two, it's possible that we may want to solicit some opinions based on some of the comments we've heard tonight. We do intend to be a good neighbor. The comments are not falling on deaf ears. And frankly, PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 103 OR 0360 El 0 G 0 ^, :`J E E 1A 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 6 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 I'd like to take up some of these people out here on some of their suggestions as to how we can become a better operator, and that may take a little bit more time on our part to do so. MR. KIFF: Well, as long as that effort was being made, and I think Mr. McCloskey knows how important it is to -- he's already addressing some of the problems, but I think there needs it be a really broad effort to address the concerns. I'm comfortable with bringing it back in a month, then, but you understand that a lot of these concerns, I think, need to be addressed within that month, which you've heard. MR. O'CONNOR: That will be more than enough time. We're planning to get it done in two weeks, but in case we can't, I would like a little more breathing room. Thank you. MR. KIFF: Okay. MR. ALLEN: All right. Well, that will be the decision, and hopefully it works, and we get together on August the 12th. And if there seems to be satisfactory progress, it can be continued. If there isn't; it won't. Okay. Thank you very much for all your 1participation. I realize nobody -- not everybody's 1 happy, and that's how the way things usually work. But PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 104 OR 0361 U 21 Q 13 L 0 0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 let's see if we can't make progress on this. Thank you. MR. O'CONNOR: Thank you. I'd like a copy, please. (Ending time: 6:25 p.m.) PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 105 1 OR 0362 A V 0 D M 0 P, n n 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 74 15 1b 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 I, the undersigned, a Certified Shorthand Reporter for the State of California, do hereby certify: That prior foregoing proceedings were taken before me at the time and place herein set forth; that any witnesses in the foregoing proceedings, prior to testifying, were placed under oath; that a verbatim record of the proceedings was made by me using machine shorthand which was thereafter transcribed under my direction; further, that the foregoing is an accurate transcription thereof. I further certify that I am neither financially interested in the action nor a relative or employee of any attorney of any of the parties. IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have this date subscribed my name. 0 Dated: F�B 2 5 2009 La"uYa A. Millsa , RPR CSR No. 9266 OR 0363 OR 0364 F] l U U 0 0 Erl J Z 0 A . AA49:24 abatement 33:5 37:11 37:13,18 89:1,5 abide75:23 97:10 ability 91:13,14 96:23 able6:19 7:18 12:19 12:22 17:9 30:23 35:19 37:22 43:7 64:22,22 73:12 92:2 98:25 99:9 absolute 31:16 37:10 46:6 absolutely 53:21 63:2 90:2 absorb70:2 70:3 abutting 51:7 accept42:16 54:18 acceptable 10:22,23 accepting 46:5 access41:14 accommodate 5 :10,10 accommod... 11:24 accomplish 51:18 account 31:10 90:11 accumulated 52:4 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 accumula... 16:14 accumula... 52:15 accurate 6:23 21:10 21.12 106:12 accused 19:16 44:10,12 Act 103:3,6 acted91:25 action 96:17 106.15 actions 47:17 59:25 active 103:21 activity 18:25 39:7 56:14 72:12 actual l6:1 ADA19:19 adapted 41:11 add44:25 added29:6 addition 10:19 39:21 53:6 79:21 additional 5:14 16:17 62:16 address4:22 5:11 8:7 10:7 13:11 13:16 15:23,24 26:11,12 36:13,14 42:1 43:5 45:2 46:12 46:25 47:3 49:17 51:4 51:11 57:18 78:19,19 82:1 83:5 85:10,13 86:4 87:6 87:17 89:3 93:22 94:13,17 94 :18 95:13,24 104:9 addressed 6:25 22:4 30:16 34:25 43:21 44:18,19 46:16 47:1 47:4 68:16 68:17 81:25 92:11 104:12 addressing 36:19 99:19 104:7 adequate 36:15 80:23 adequately 61:1 adjacent 15:2 24:16 72:9 74:4 administ... 37:17 admit20:2 adopt 28:14 adopted . 100 :15 adoption 47:18 95:15 ADP4:25 8:13 39:9 43:1 91:4 adults 21:25 22:3 adverse 62:25 80:3 80:4 affect35:11 affiliation 87:25 88:13 a£ford40:17 afternoon 23:20 38:14 a4enda4:8 32:16 59:21 90:17 age - inap... 36:6 74:18 aggressive 34:5 aggressi... 40:21 ago 13 : 7 16:25 40:3 40:6 48:12 53:13 90:8 95:10,16 agree 19:21 102:25 agreeable 13:12,24 agreedl9:5 29:4 agreement 15:23 16:2 102.24 ahead7:25 65.6 air 81 :11 Alana49:24 5D:5 alcoholism 77:13 allegations 35:25 44:8 allege 34:15 alleged PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 Page 1 36:15 44:7 Allen l:9 4:4,6 6:5 7:6,11,18 7:23 8:17 10:1,4 12:15,21 13:1,5,10 13:14 14:1 14:11,15 14:20,22 15:6,21 16:3,8,10 18 :15 20:21 21:16,20 23:15,18 23:20 25:15 26:6 26:10 28:6 30:14 32:10,15 32:18,20 37:8,10,19 38:3,11,21 39:2,16,19 42:25 46 :11,12 47:16 48:3 48:10 50:9 51 :3,19,21 54:10 63:10 64:1 64:4,7,10 64:15,18 64:24 65:5 66:13,16 66:21,23 70:10,11 70:13,16 71:4,7,9 78:25 79:2 80:13,15 80:17,25 81:15 82:7 82:11,17 83:5 85:9 85:23 87:9 OR 0365 0 0 G 0 E 0 C C E J LJ 87:12,15 87 :22 88:8 86:23 89:18,21 89:25 92:4 92:7 96:8 97:5 100:10 102:8,18 104:19 Allen's 28:18 alley 11:13 12:4 52:4 52:16 61:2 84:16 alleys 25:6 85:25 alleyway 65:18 alleyways 25:9 allow35:2,6 35:24 69:6 84 :24 87 :20 90:23 93:6 93:9 95:7 allowed 37:5 47:2 50:16 5 0: 21 73:19,23 90 :3 95:3 allowing 95:23 99.16 allows33:13 34:21 35:5 35:8 93 :5 93:11 alluded 98:11 alternative 5:22 45:10 45:14 altogether 75:24 aluminum PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 67:23 ambulatory 60:5 91:13 amenable 82:3 amendment 9:15,16,22 American 27 :23 amountl9:9 27:10 32:25 37 :25 47:24 59 :5 61:10 67:2 94:8 analysis 35.13 and /or30 :24 84:13 92:24 Angeles3:5 Anonymous 34:2 49:8 60:23 answerl3:11 36:23 49:8 51:15 78:23 100:23 answered 41:16 answers 78 :20 88:6 92:8 anybody 62:21 86:16 88:15 anymore51:4 94:25 anyway30 :22 31:20 APA 22:22 27:21,22 28:14 92 :19 apart60:6 apartment 27 :9 29:14 29 :25 66:11 67:1 67:3,4 77:7 apologize 8:1 57:11 75:17 94:14 apparent 36:15 appea138:16 39:1 appear52:23 APPEARANCES 3:1 appears 30:15 63:16 applicable 29:20 Applicant 6:6 7:24 19:1 39:13 39:17 79:4 81:19 82:9 85:10 96:13,18 97.10 98 :15,25 application 4:21 5:19 5:23 8:7,8 28:8 37:20 66:18 71:1 90:15 91:18 97:3 applied 58 :16 59:2 applies 40:1 46:1 91:6 apply 17:12 91:22 97:2 applying 59:1 appointed 4:6 appreciate 39:24 54:4 54:6,11 65:7 approach 41:12 approaching 96:7 appropriate 8:12 18:23 28:3 57:11 57:12 93:8 93 :23 appropri... 81:25 94:4 approval 4 :18 5:4 5:18,19,21 5:25 10:9 18 :2 24:9 28:22 33:14 53:15 71:17 approvals 66:6 approve. 31:22 approved 18:1 20:18 53:8 63 :19 66:6 80:6 80:11 97:4 approximate 72 :16 arbitrary 63:16,21 93:16 arbitration 66:5 area10:20 11:6,8,16 11:20 12:5 14:23 15:8 30:17 53:10 56:9 56:14 60:9 71:1,2 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 Page 2 72:7,7 76:11,15 77:2 92:22 92.24 areas 18:7 24:20 arguably 30:1 85:1 100:4 argue 93:8 argument 17:24 arisen 5:12 arrive 62:20 ashtrays 69:22 asked24:21 45:8 55:16 72:15 79:2 87:9-90:13 98:5 asking 22:21 39:6 asleep 73:8 aspect 25:11 aspects 56:24 assemblies 46:20 47:1 85:24 86:2 assembly 29:2,5 46:14 71:21 82 :21 83:11 assert34:1 35:6 assignment 66:5 Assistant 3:8,9 22:20 Associate 3:8,9 associated 38:5 89:24 Association OR 0366 L H E PA 0 U U L KI 0 C 27:23 assume 35:5 45:23 assurance 96:21 assure 5:6 102:1 atrocious 57:14 attempt 36:11 100:19 101:12 attempted 42:1 attempting 31:18 54:23 attempts 39:24 attendl7:10 34:1,4 47:8 48:17 48:21 49:3 50:6,7 60:23 90:1 93:25 attendance 55:19 101:25 attended 49:6,19,19 attending 49:7 attention 34:4 44:15 44:17 83:25 attitude 13:20 attorney8:2 22:20 57 :20 106:16 attorneys 52:22 attorney's 22:20 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 attractive 77:3 78:9 attributed 36:25 audience 17:8 34:24 44:11,20 94:20 audience's 38:22 August 102:22 104:21 author21 :21 21:24 23:1 author's 23:9 automobile 62:21 available 103:12 Avenue3 :5 average 28:17 avoid 19:15 'aware 9:3 50:24 58:20 88:24 89:3 B back 7:2,7 9:21 10 :14 10:18 11:10 12:7 14:12,13 16:18 17:20 26:7 3 0: 12 31:23,25 32:6,8 35:22 39:8 39:8 40 :7 44:23 47:5 48:8,25 52:2 61:17 66:11 69:18 79:9 81 :16 84:8 96:20 99:15,22 101:11 102:7 103:11 104:10 backyard 73:13 bad20 :17 42:6,8 52:19 79:16,23 80:1 balancing 40:9 Balboa4:9 4:19 16:11 18:1 21:14 25:23 26:4 29:1,4,7 32:16 33:4 35:14,22 36:24,25 37:1 52:14 53:7,8 60:13 62:25 63:5 63:17,22 66:5 74:4 79:8,8,10 80:11 86:23 87:23 93:2 ban 29: 13, 14 30:1 banging73:4 banned29:17 29:25 bans 2 9: 19 barbecue 61 :23 barbecue 62:18 barbeques 85:19,24 86:2 based5:18 58:22 76:8 90:24 93:16 96:14 102:25 103:23 basically 74:7 92:18 basis 22:2 31:22 56:21 57:4 57:6,9 58:6 77:9 77:16 80:7 83:13 batteries 11:2 Bay69.1 79:20 89:3 90:19,25 91:17 92:1 beach 1:10 2:8,9 3:3 3:7,10 4:1 20:23 22:2 28:17 29:18 34:7 39:22 48:18,24 49:9,11 50:6,7 54:2,19 56:4,7,20 57:7,22 61:3 67 :13 66:14 69 :16 70:6 71:10 77:5 77 :22 84:10,11 89 :20 93:20 94:6 94:25 95:24 beaches 17:22 25:8 bears 31:3 beautiful 69:17 77:2 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 Page 3 'bed5:9 8 :10 8:11 27:17 28:23 36:21 42:24 43:1 43:2 57:23 58:6 73:3 92:1 101:15 103:9 bedroom 22:1 22:3 55:25 67:17 73:6 bedrooms 4:23 8:13 26:19 27:18,19 81:12 beds4:23,24 4:25 27:17 27 :19 28:10,25 29:3,6 31:10 36:22 42:24 43:2 43:11 46:7 97:12 99:4 99:4,5,25 99 :25 100:3 beg25 :10 began 55:17 beginning 2:9 41:12 69:3 98:1 behalf 2 :7 behavior 18 :12 45 :17 46:21 62:25 71:19 99 :17 behaviors 63:3 believe 5:16 5:20 7:8 OR 0367 ra D U U 21 7 8:11 18:12 31:21 33:13 34:21 37:2 37:4 38:7 42:25 45:18 46:13 48:6 48:7 62:11 79:12 83:25 91:17,25 102:19 believed 39:14 believes 91:20 Belmont 29:18 beneficial 99:7 benefit 38 :22 benignly 19 :15 best 41:18 41:19 42:9 42:14 51:12 57:19,22 68:1 80:8 better5:10 32:21 39:5 39:12 42 :15,18 79:14 82:8 89:11 101:3 102:3,12 104:2 beyond54:17 70:24 73:5 84:6 big47:22 49:10 66:4 70:1 biggest 10:25 PUBLIC HEARING - 2/12/2009 19:13 bikes65:25 bin 84:25 65 :4 birthdays 74 :20 bit8:22 10:25 17:6 17:22 26:12 27:8 43:20,21 44:10 65:3 75:16 76 :23 77:18 82:3 86:20 92 :10 104:3 black54:23 blank23 :5 53:25 blarring 68:5 73 :5 block 20:11 20 :12 22:12,15 22:16,18 22:23,25 23:7,10 28:4,16,17 28:20,21 31:8,12 37:3 62:21 63:18 92:17,20 92:21,22 93:1,2,5 93:13,15 blocked26:5 blocks 28:15 board31:17 92:23 boardwalk 92:24 Bob 20:23 26:11 27:14,21 58:9 BOBK03:4 bodies55:25 book 49:23 books31:8 bottom11:11 boulevard 2:8 3:10 4:9,20 16:11 25:24 26:5 32:17 60:14 63:5 63:17,22 66:5 77:23 bounded 92 :22,24 box 81: 7 breaking 94:10 breathe24:6 76:6 breathing 25:3 76:4 103:16 104:16 brief31:4 briefly 29:8 bring14:2 26:7 31:18 31:23,25 32:6 74:20 81:16 bringing 43:16 104:10 brings29:9 broad104:8 brought 29:6 30 :10 34:4 38:14 44:15,17 49:23 75:1 84:16 89:2 93:20 94:14 103 :11 Brown 3 : 9 14:19,21 21:24 90:4 build69:22 69:24 75:22 87:17,17 94:15 building 4:22 21:25 26:2 29:14 29:25 53:3 58 :14,21 59:11 68:25 76:21 81:9 91:20 buildings 77:7 81:10 built 94:16 94:17 bunch48:7 76:19,20 burden 17 :18 21:22,23 22:6 26 :16 27:2,13 34:16 52:16 56:6 59:8,9 60:8 93:24 103:19 burdening 61:24 business 17:20 42:13,23 43:7,8,10 43 :12 44:24 57:24 76:25 77:6 78:10 79:24 95:5 C CA3:5,10,14 cake 74:20 74:20 calendar 89:14 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 Page 4 calendars 32:8 California 1:10 2:9 4:1 106:5 call24:19. 41:17 44:23 57:4 83:19 91:11 102:20 called40:4 47 :19 69:2 95:11 calls27 :6 27:10 56:7 56:9 calming 56:24 capability 10:11,12 capable 60:7 car50:20,22 50:25 62:10 carcinogen 24:1 care4 :19 7:1 15:3 20:12 22:12 23:12 28:3 35:10 60:5 67:24 85:15 86:9 86:9 careful 45:7 100:6 103:10 carefully 25 :11 cares52:12 Carried9:19 cars26:22 27:10 45:16 62:7 62:12,17 65:25 OR 0368 0 C C G U C L M 0 E7 V-3 83:16 84:9 case8:25 18:21 23:8 50:17,19 50:24 63:11 93 :1 104:16 cases 15:13 28:15 39:6 91:10 92:12,25 95:2 categories 60:2 category 102:6 caught43:24 43:24 44:16 60 :10 cause10:13 37:18 caused 37:3 86:9 causing 36:24 ceiling 81:.7 cell4:10 44:23 center3:14 18:22 23:12 certain 18:20 79:13 98:20,23 102:20 certainly 15:2 33:21 34:6 40:1 44:10 57 :12 75:3 96:11 98:21 99:8 Certified 2:11 106:4 certify 106:5,14 PUBLIC HEARING - 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2/12/2009 39:21 41:25 48:3 52:6,11,19 52:23 53:1 53 :14,17 67:14 79:17 84:12,19 93:2 94:20 94:24 95:23 99:19 Recovery's 53:6,24 rectangle 93:11,12 redirect 12 :6 reduce 10:11 reduced 99:25 reducing 42:24 43:2 reduction 5:9 8:10 43:3,16 57:23 69:10 refer 16:18 referencing 37:22 reflect 56:19 regard40:4 regarding 8:17,23 40:21 41:4 42:3 43:19 44:1 45:16 45:22,24 46:2 56:6 regardless 24:13 regards 26:1 56:22 region93:25 regrettable 44:14,15 regrettably 43:11 regular57:6 57:9 77:8 77:16 regularly 25:6 regulate 94:4 regulated 26:23 regulation 19:3 regulations 45:16 regulato... 19:5 regulatory 26:20 rehab 23:8 56:24 58:16,16 58 :21 59:14 60:8 70 :20,21 70:22,25 77:1,13 79:24 80:19 86:25 rehabs 56:20 59:17 86:7 86:8 reiterate 72:15 73:17 reiteration 54:4 rejected 35.1 related45:5 45:24,25 60:19 61:18 72:4 73:11 relates 13:16 15:22 17:4 42:22 45:9 45 :21 60:21 96:10 relation... 79:10 88:21 97:16 relative 23:25 24:25 106:15 relatively 92:12 reluctant 96:13 rely 92:14 relying 21:9 21:10 remain 43:7 72:23 remedy 36:11 84:14 remember 26:18 27 :11,17 91:3 remind38:9 removal 96:25 remove52:4 rent67:11 rental33.21 45:14 48:4 58:4 rentals 33:22 59:15 rented45:15 reopen 98:24 repeated 17:15 replaces 10:9 report4:12 4:16 5:3 5:13 6:2 7:14 21:6 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647 -9099 Page 22 23:2 26:14 31.25 36:17 50:18 60:19,22 61:7 81:6 83:7,23 92:15 101:19 Reporter 2:12 25:22 38:23 89:7 106:5 reports 21:23 represent 8:3 39:20 64 :21 represen... 17:8 57:21 represen... 52:8 represen... 39:21 41:5 request 4:17 31:23 53:17,17 58:1 66:17 80 :10 103:16 requesting 5:24 require 94:2 required 13:3 73:14 81:17 require=... 31:16 53.12,15 requires 9:1 94:5 requiring 9:15 research 9:3 88:19 reside 95:24 residence 11:23 45:9 OR 0386 n J A J C L 0 0 66:8 72:14 78:17 88:13 residences 95:25 resident 20:23 39:22 56:3 72:16 73:24 residential 4:19,22 18:7,8 22:12 28:3 33.2 52:13 67:1 71:11 88:25 89:4 91:11,12 95:1,3,6,8 residents 16:14 17:5 17:12 25:5 26:3 30:23 34:1 40:23 41:4 45:7 48:16,20 48:23,25 50:10,12 60:23 61:15 62:6 62:11,14 62:25 65:11,15 65:19,23 65:24 66:10 72:9 90:1 residing 47 :25 Resolution 5:25 31:24 32:1,5 100.15 resolve 96:13 respect4:15 26:8 33:14 37:19 45:6 PUBLIC HEARING - 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RA requests go before a hearing officer at a public hearing, and can be appealed to the City Council. ir Ordinance 2oo8 -oS exempts one type of home from the Use Permit requirement— ADP - licensed treatment homes: • Housing six or fewer persons, and • Which do not operate integrally with other facilities ( "Integral Facilities "). US District Court Judge James Selna in May 20o8 blocked the City from requiring networked ADP - licensed 6 and Unders from going through the Use Permit process (SLBTS). AI, T7 O A O O Ocean Recovery Ib91'l MR&Ibba* Item xS -LOCrIyom — MarcononSouthern CaWoy1H, 5810W oro,av etc QWen from (Gated hn ebat¢ment 2.203h) —IDST ateay. harlhesc N>akelkat lnt"Y 3d-W -1327 Wes, SWoba -2004• . .pmt ona1iPhO"� ° ra[e wtlet)- 115 Easr u ^Sur,- 4ss>,wY 'CRAst Church O�"emsseo day (kahblkbe�raCe�s) 8105 Ease SS"Seteet -747 away hfadna Vasrk Tot Los p510 Westnsatooa 4qa West Balooe —SIry •K'W 35lYbepY SUBJECT PROPERTY. 1601 WEST BALBOA (OCEAN RECOVERY) FINDINGS REQUIRED TO APPROVE THIS GROUP RESIDENTIAL USE PERMIT K•Accomsect-M ~tbeftfireSaW.Generally 1, this ralant Rem wtt.VA callmord? wcmditbn,Affvfflthl3h)%dingt0b~ M �2 v rn - TiutlmwendpropomdwrAhiowvAllabtheetobe Beds capped a 14. consistent with the General Men and notbe detrimental to • "cassambty'am pu rc healds, saw, powoN morals, comfort. " wel" or f4a. • Restore PMM for parking — firnit prap war for pm*ft persons le"IM in Gr3dje0u, to d1d nek;;kborhMd ofth6 lft� thirstriff, transport van, visitors, and wontbe daukrAnW to the properties or brcipmwernant; In (meommaynotht""m tle vidntry or pe the gener;d wdbm at the My, 420910.35—A3. §20MA35—A,4. §20910.06 0 -A 620.910.0.60-8 §20,910.X00—C no 12C1.910.060-0 I llso will be carnpa2lble %Ah the character of the nebMarbood y". and wowt creall, an Pyermnceotraden of rood"Aill sent uums. 020.91AM—E • 0 Ith. O 4�`.;7 .� =�'� t�F�E -'., � ���ti ��i ae 'r�r €a ��1� ��� -�.c. "i.,�.i���.i��� • Declining home values. The belief that the presence of recovery facilities is any more impactful on property values than changes in the housing market, long -term rentals, vacation rentals, or other non - single family uses has been challenged nationwide. • Ocean Recovery's clients' participation (or lack thereof) in the Saturday Qa 9:3o a.m. Narcotics Anonymous ( "NA ") meetings at 151h Street. Ocean Recovery has consistently said that its residents do not attend that meeting. ■ Allegations that recovery homes are a cost burden to the City. There is no evidence to suggest that recovery homes cost the City any more in services than a typical multi - family building housing the same amount of people, whether that is in police or emergency medical calls for service or trash collection. • Allegations that this specific use at =3.5 West Balboa is too close to Newport Elementary School. This use is roughly 74o' away from Newport Elementary School. While the NBMC ( §20.9aA.o6oD.a..) allows the hearing officer to consider "the proximity of the use location to schools, parks, other residential care facilities, outlets for alcoholic beverages and any other uses which could be affected by or affect the operation of the subject use (emphasis added)," there is no evidence on the record that Newport Elementary — at 75o' away — affects or is affected by this specific use. ■ General comments about recovery homes citywide, without directing specific comments to o the operation at:L=5 West Balboa. 0 a 0 w ■ Summary of property, use ■ Staff Recommendation: ■ Approve with conditions, including: • s4 -bed limit (due to staff concerns about possible inability to manage a facility with 22 beds) • Cease assembly uses; • Correct code violations (garage conversions) • Review sooner than typical UP — 6 months. • More. 0 A 0 A SUBJECT PROPERTY: 1115 WEST BALBOA (OCEAN RECOVERY) FINDINGS REQUIRED TO APPROVE THIS GROUP RESIDENTIAL USE PERMIT 4209L035 -A.1. 7hrt tM rae me pmpased mrdkmna wip dlow Me rcem tz aemlm m,hh the General Hen and notbe eetrimainlla 42091035 -A.2. puMche+dth,s�ety peao, morah, contort,"Wdraed peswrieteddeyM os aejaorrt tadxw{�hoaimeaFdq uce, and won4 be aelAmertbl t a the pmpetde ar brlpraannorts M the ridnity ormtho gmml weRme of the My. MSL035 -0.3. WD9L035 -A.9. 420- "AAe0•A 0=93A.060 -9 42o.9xA.DeD -D 420910.060 -D IUse wlA0e t0mpatmla witfi the durec0erofthe nel�borhwe ene woKtwp sn'eserrarKeritndon orroslemWl on uwa. J O A O Os • gads capped at x4. • No assearWyroai No. ' Restma garagm for parWng- Ihek prW use forporking for staf f, In rwPM een, sbkars. • Pierrtcmrynot heuecan • Vmpid•ependdrap.aff Wme. • Ilse Pemdt nviwrx sraW N7991A35.ii No ye;prvdedabate soaenm eWMicfararhigjm en0otermmg anrewkh coiBew¢. wfth nearby 6,oup ResldedW Um Fo he sulanittatvftcomplbno sport by COee Fnfamr,r arcemerr� the Neniag ORFareaddeetermMe roruwix 0 A O V ■ Allegations made that are specific to this property, which may indicate an inability to manage 3.3.3.5 West Balboa in a manner that is respectful of the neighborhood's peace and quiet enjoyment. Specifically: • Threatening, confrontational, or age - inappropriate interactions of clients with neighbors; • Excessive profanity, especially when youth are nearby; • Excessive noise, as well as noise late at night; • Poor and inappropriate responses from clients when neighbors attemptto remedy bad interactions, noise concerns, or profanity by themselves; • Excessive second -hand smoke, more than one would expect if the facility held an identical amount of persons not in recovery; • Trash problems — odor, vectors, cans placed too early and removed too late; • Curfew violations; and • An apparent lack of adequate on -site supervision. 0 0 I[',,